28 Sep
2008
28 Sep
'08
5:21 p.m.
Hi,
I ask the above because of what I see happening...
We have an organisation capable of taking free software to the common man,
bridging the digital divide, building a better knowledge society...
but
1. The members of the FSF-I work group have not met nor changed in
ages..(see the Who's who for reference)
2. The members of the FSF-I and a few others throw accusations against teams
trying to do something to popularise free software by using some frivolous
technicalities...
3. Just 5 men on the FSF-I board who do nothing but talk a lot(paper
tigers)...
More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I rotting to death due to
inactivity...
@ The board of directors
Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves) with
those who can.
Wishing you to do what is right in the best interest of the movement,
Jack As
28 Sep
28 Sep
5:41 p.m.
On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 10:51 PM, Jack As <jcakas(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
I ask the above because of what I see happening...
We have an organisation capable of taking free software to the common man,
bridging the digital divide, building a better knowledge society...
Very Nice , could we know more about yourself
2. The members of the FSF-I and a few others throw accusations against teams
trying to do something to popularise free software by using some frivolous
technicalities...
I dont think any one can stop working towards the movement intitiated by RMS
More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I rotting to death due to
inactivity...
I completely disagree to this point that fsf-India is inactive..
I dont think fsf-India is inactive, to the best of my knowledge they are
doing their best
@ The board of directors
Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves) with
those who can.
whether fsf-India is doing something in such a way that it could be noticed
by people or not , whatever the case i am there always to be part of the
free software movement initiated by RMS, I support fsf-I whoever is there at
whatever situation..
whoever is there in the board does not stop or does not matter much for me
to carry on the movement
_______________________________________________
Fsf-friends mailing list
Fsf-friends(a)mm.gnu.org.in
http://mm.gnu.org.in/mailman/listinfo/fsf-friends
7:13 p.m.
FSF was formed to promote and protect the free software. Bridging digital divide,
knowledge society and free software for common man.. are some what different goals, but
free software has a role to play. If you could contribute in any ways, you are welcome.
Your accusations of "CPIM take over" or "Board inactivity" are
unfounded. There are a
number of achievements to list by FSF-I since it was founded in 2001. I am sure, everyone
in this list are aware of them. If you have real legitimate concerns, please discuss them
here with some backing.
Thanks for the wishes.
--
Anand Babu Periasamy
GPG Key ID: 0x62E15A31
Blog [http://ab.freeshell.org]
The GNU Operating System [http://www.gnu.org]
Z RESEARCH Inc [http://www.zresearch.com]
Jack As wrote:
Hi,
I ask the above because of what I see happening...
We have an organisation capable of taking free software to the common
man, bridging the digital divide, building a better knowledge society...
but
1. The members of the FSF-I work group have not met nor changed in
ages..(see the Who's who for reference)
2. The members of the FSF-I and a few others throw accusations against
teams trying to do something to popularise free software by using some
frivolous technicalities...
3. Just 5 men on the FSF-I board who do nothing but talk a lot(paper
tigers)...
More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I rotting to death due
to inactivity...
@ The board of directors
Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves)
with those who can.
Wishing you to do what is right in the best interest of the movement,
Jack As
------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________
Fsf-friends mailing list
Fsf-friends(a)mm.gnu.org.in
http://mm.gnu.org.in/mailman/listinfo/fsf-friends
7:20 p.m.
Your accusations of "CPIM take over" or "Board inactivity" are
unfounded.
There are a
number of achievements to list by FSF-I since it was founded in 2001. I am
sure, everyone
in this list are aware of them.
Yes we are aware of them
If you have real legitimate concerns, please discuss
them
here with some backing.
I too agree to this
Yes those who are really worried about some of the things that are not on
track -- instead of accusing or pointing figure at those it will be great
to take the things on right track by giving valuable suggestions and playing
the role of a responsible member of the group or community..... This is what
the livable society is all about
7:46 p.m.
"Jack As" <jcakas(a)gmail.com> writes:
2. The members of the FSF-I and a few others throw
accusations against teams trying to do something to
popularise free software by using some frivolous technicalities...
If its about the recent Chennai Issue, Nagarjuna sir and sasikumar sir
has clarified on that,right?
or otherwise, please explain what you are saying about.
3. Just 5 men on the FSF-I board who do nothing but
talk a lot(paper tigers)...
What about the works on ooxml issue? India had a good and firm stand on
document freedom.Also nowadays Software patent issues are at peak.
More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I
rotting to death due to inactivity...
@ The board of directors
Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves) with those who can.
Wishing you to do what is right in the best interest of the movement,
Jack As
Perhaps we could have done better,but it is not the time to have lot
more confusions. Its today's urgent need to fight against issues of
atmost importance like Software patents. And So far we are having a
good progress on the issue,and we should continue to fight. For that
we should understand ourselves the Culture that Swathanthra Software
philosophy puts forward, and make the whole India to realize and fight
for their Freedom, in a Collaborative way.
And aren't these kinds of moves making small hindrances to the fights we are already
doing against Software patents which is currently Lead by FSF-I in
India ?
Regards
Shyam K
8:31 p.m.
On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 1:16 AM, Shyam Karanattu <mail(a)swathanthran.in>wrote;wrote:
I feel FSF India's role is 'Talking a lot' . It is the time we need more
free software advocates all over the country who value freedom.
Anivar
--
Any responsible politician should be encouraging a home grown Free Software
industry because it creates the basis for future jobs. Learning Windows is
like learning to eat every meal at McDonalds.
3. Just 5 men
on the FSF-I board who do nothing but talk a lot(paper
tigers)...
10:23 p.m.
On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 10:51 PM, Jack As <jcakas(a)gmail.com> wrote:
1. The members of the FSF-I work group have not met
nor changed in
ages..(see the Who's who for reference)
Interesting. What does the rule book say?
2. The members of the FSF-I and a few others throw
accusations against teams
trying to do something to popularise free software by using some frivolous
technicalities...
Members are entitled to their views and those are not necessarily the FSF's.
Yes, throwing accusations against other advocates without proper proof
and using sensationalist headlines is bad.
3. Just 5 men on the FSF-I board who do nothing but
talk a lot(paper
tigers)...
Some of them do not talk enough. A larger board can be useful. FSF-I
needs to help with advocacy too. FSF-I has done some work, their
website is not informative enough.
More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I
rotting to death due to
inactivity...
There should be no problem if the Left as a whole joins the FSF-I,
substantial sections are certainly active in promoting FOSS. E.g. of a
leftist website: http://www.pragoti.org/
You can see the mailing list archives of FSF-I for more details on
past activities.
Why don't you suggest some path-breaking activities?
Best
A. Mani
--
A. Mani
Member, Cal. Math. Soc
29 Sep
29 Sep
4:45 a.m.
2008/9/28 Jack As <jcakas(a)gmail.com>
<snip>but
1. The members of the FSF-I work group have not met nor changed in
ages..(see the Who's who for reference)
Having been active for quite sometime now I have noticed that the FSF-I
leadership does not bother to give either organisational or political or any
guidance despite numerous requests from the community. I do not know if this
is due to ignorance or because they do not want to.
Of course, most of the people on the work group have been inactive over a
long period of time and need to be replaced by more active members.
It does give rise to suspicion whether the members have not been changed
just to ensure that a few remain in power.
2. The members of the FSF-I and a few others throw accusations against teams
trying to do something to popularise free software by
using some frivolous
technicalities...
Whether Chennai or Kerala or whereever...
3. Just 5 men on the FSF-I board who do nothing but talk a lot(paper
tigers)...
This is not entirely true. On the Board we have Kiran who's team is known to
be doing a lot of ground work in AP. I am not sure about the others'
involvement in ground work though they do do a lot of other things...
More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I rotting to death due to
inactivity...
@ The board of directors
Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves) with
those who can.
Wishing you to do what is right in the best interest of the movement,
Jack As
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
6:08 a.m.
2008/9/28 Vikram Vincent <vincentvikram(a)gmail.com>om>:
Looks like Jack Ass got a strong supporter in the community.
We in both cases we are asking them not to use FSF India's name since
they have not approached FSF India.
As you are aware FSF India does not go out and throw accusations
against so many communities and events like foss.in, freed.in, mukt.in
since they don't use FSF India name to take advantage.
The issue here came when some people want to take credit of the work
that FSF India has done without consulting with FSF India and tried to
make their event look like it is organised by FSF India.
We would not have a problem if
1) They don't mention FSF India anywhere OR
2) Discuss with FSF India if they want to use the name
Oh! So you are not aware of the work Nagarjuna has been doing for
Document Freedom and Software patents campaign (to mention a few).
Probably it is time for you to wake up from "Kiran is everything
dream" and look out for the contributions of so many individuals and
communities to promote Free Software. I don't disagree with you for
the fact that Kiran is active, but that does not mean everyone else is
inactive.
Don't make your ignorance, a right.
Having been active for quite sometime now I have
noticed that the FSF-I
leadership does not bother to give either organisational or political or any
guidance despite numerous requests from the community. I do not know if this
is due to ignorance or because they do not want to.
I have felt many people want to take authority and control and legacy
of the community instead of strengthening and promoting the community.
Many new Free Software communities are coming up and is a welcome
sign. The problem arises when the new communities tries to hijack the
legacy and name of the existing communities.
I am sure you might be aware of the existence of many Free Software
organisations other than FSF like IndLinux and many user groups.
Of course, most of the people on the work group have
been inactive over a
long period of time and need to be replaced by more active members.
I would agree to this. We need to include more active contributors to
the working group.
It does give rise to suspicion whether the members
have not been changed
just to ensure that a few remain in power.
This is the issue when some want power first before contribution and
when they don't get it as normal custom in the community. In the Free
Software community leaders emerge from themselves when people take
initiatives.
2. The members
of the FSF-I and a few others throw accusations against
teams trying to do something to popularise free software by using some
frivolous technicalities...
Whether Chennai or Kerala or whereever...
> 3. Just 5 men
on the FSF-I board who do nothing but talk a lot(paper
tigers)...
This is not entirely true. On the Board we have Kiran who's team is known to
be doing a lot of ground work in AP. I am not sure about the others'
involvement in ground work though they do do a lot of other things...
> More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about FSF-I
rotting to death due to
> inactivity...
You can perceive it is any way you like. I know you are a member of
fsf-friends and you can take initiative for activities instead of
blaming someone. I know you have been doing good work and I appreciate
your contributions. But that does not give you any right to discredit
the work done by others.
> @ The board of directors
> Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves) with
> those who can.
This is a serious insult to the people in the community. You having
Kiran's phone number does not mean all others are inactive. And please
don't judge the contributions of an organisation as great as FSF
India. You are belittling yourself by doing that.
I agree with you on the fact that we need more people in the working group.
Vikram, you can do better than that. Come on !
Cheers
Praveen
--
പ്രവീണ് അരിമ്പ്രത്തൊടിയില്
<GPLv2> I know my rights; I want my phone call!
<DRM> What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
(as seen on /.)
Join The DRM Elimination Crew Now!
http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Anti-DRM-Campaign
6:24 a.m.
2008/9/29 Praveen A <pravi.a(a)gmail.com>
<snip>
Vikram, you can do better than that. Come on !
Quite a few people have made relevant points from each one's perspective.
As
noted by many we need more fresh blood in the governing body FSF-India to
take forward the movement in a holistic manner and that cannot be ignored.
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
6:31 a.m.
On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 11:54 AM, Vikram Vincent <vincentvikram(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
2008/9/29 Praveen A <pravi.a(a)gmail.com>
I feel the way forward is not through baseless Flame wars!!
Anivar
--
Any responsible politician should be encouraging a home grown Free Software
industry because it creates the basis for future jobs. Learning Windows is
like learning to eat every meal at McDonalds.
<snip>
Vikram, you can do better than that. Come on !
Quite a few people have made relevant points from each one's perspective.
As
noted by many we need more fresh blood in the governing body FSF-India
to take forward the movement in a holistic manner and that cannot be
ignored.
6:32 a.m.
2008/9/29 Vikram Vincent <vincentvikram(a)gmail.com>om>:
Quite a few people have made relevant points from each
one's perspective.
As noted by many we need more fresh blood in the governing body FSF-India to
take forward the movement in a holistic manner and that cannot be ignored.
I was not talking about the governing body, but the working group.
Cheers
Praveen
--
പ്രവീണ് അരിമ്പ്രത്തൊടിയില്
<GPLv2> I know my rights; I want my phone call!
<DRM> What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
(as seen on /.)
Join The DRM Elimination Crew Now!
http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Anti-DRM-Campaign
6:38 a.m.
2008/9/29 Praveen A <pravi.a(a)gmail.com>
2008/9/29 Vikram Vincent
<vincentvikram(a)gmail.com>om>:
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
Quite a few people have made relevant points from
each one's perspective.
As noted by many we need more fresh blood in the governing body FSF-India
to
take forward the movement in a holistic manner
and that cannot be
ignored.
I was not talking about the governing body, but the working group.
I am referring to both. Anyway, we are in partial agreement...
6:47 a.m.
Praveen,
2008/9/29 Praveen A <pravi.a(a)gmail.com>
<snip>
reply. Do
not take cheap shots.
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
> More than a CPIM takeover I am worried about
FSF-I rotting to death due
to
> inactivity...
You can perceive it is any way you like. I know you are a member of
fsf-friends and you can take initiative for activities instead of
blaming someone. I know you have been doing good work and I appreciate
your contributions. But that does not give you any right to discredit
the work done by others.
> @ The board of directors
> Kindly replace the people who do nothing(including your kind selves)
with
> those who can.
This is a serious insult to the people in the community. You having
Kiran's phone number does not mean all others are inactive. And please
don't judge the contributions of an organisation as great as FSF
India. You are belittling yourself by doing that.
I agree with you on the fact that we need more people in the working group.
Vikram, you can do better than that. Come on !
I you are addressing me then quote the sections that I have sent and then
6:54 a.m.
OK what is happening
Lets stop this thread------ some anonymous mail without revealing his / her
identity,
without knowing or with knowing and having some intentions to support some
one or just for creating some confusions and disturb the great GNU Minds is
making us all waste our energy and time
Lets neglect this mail for the following reasons -- if that person was a
believer in free software philosophy then he should have given clear / bold
suggestions....
1. Until and unless that person is revealing the identity
2. Even after so many threads --- he himself is sooooo inactive ( why r v
wasting time)
3. Regarding changes -- that will happen naturally
Grand mother skin might be scaled / old, but that is the skin which has lot
of love and care for the young skins because of which the skin glows
----If we want to comment on some one lets do one work better than what that
person has done and then lets comment-- otherwise we will not have any right
to comment-----
Lets stop and keep on fighting for the software freedom and carry on the
free software movement initiated by RMS
6:53 a.m.
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Hash: SHA1
On Monday 29 Sep 2008, Praveen A wrote:
[snip]
As you are aware FSF India does not go out and throw accusations
against so many communities and events like foss.in, freed.in,
mukt.in since they don't use FSF India name to take advantage.
The issue here came when some people want to take credit of the work
that FSF India has done without consulting with FSF India and tried
to make their event look like it is organised by FSF India.
I take strong exception to your using freed.in as an example of an event
that (a) leverages the FSFI name to garner support and (b) goes around
throwing accusations against any (FOSS) community.
As the very name suggests, freed.in is about freedom. Our motto is:
Freedom in Technology and Software
Our theme last year was:
Knowledge Shall Set You Free
We promote freedom, even to the extent of not permitting proprietary
plugins like Ad*be Fl*sh to be demonstrated in our vendor area.
Even if we don't have FSFI officially participating in freed.in they
(FSFI) have a standing invitation to join us to help promote freedom,
and many members of FSFI have spoken at and participated in freed.in
over the years (and Freedel before that).
Kindly provide some facts for making that statement denigrating
freed.in. If you don't have any, I'd expect an apology. Ignorance is
no excuse for slander.
Regards,
- -- Raju
- --
Raj Mathur raju(a)kandalaya.org http://kandalaya.org/
GPG: 78D4 FC67 367F 40E2 0DD5 0FEF C968 D0EF CC68 D17F
PsyTrance & Chill: http://schizoid.in/ || It is the mind that moves
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7:05 a.m.
2008/9/29 Raj Mathur <raju(a)linux-delhi.org>rg>:
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Hash: SHA1
On Monday 29 Sep 2008, Praveen A wrote:
If you read carefully what I have written again... I was talking about
some examples events which _DOES NOT_ use FSF India name without their
permission.
--
പ്രവീണ് അരിമ്പ്രത്തൊടിയില്
<GPLv2> I know my rights; I want my phone call!
<DRM> What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
(as seen on /.)
Join The DRM Elimination Crew Now!
http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Anti-DRM-Campaign
[snip]
As you are aware FSF India does not go out and throw accusations
against so many communities and events like foss.in, freed.in,
mukt.in since they don't use FSF India name to take advantage.
The issue here came when some people want to take credit of the work
that FSF India has done without consulting with FSF India and tried
to make their event look like it is organised by FSF India.
I take strong exception to your using freed.in as an example of an event
that (a) leverages the FSFI name to garner support and (b) goes around
throwing accusations against any (FOSS) community.
7:19 a.m.
2008/9/29 Praveen A <pravi.a(a)gmail.com>
If you read carefully what I have written again... I was talking about
some examples events which _DOES NOT_ use FSF India name without their
permission.
But you definitely owe me an apology. I did not expect such cheapness from
you.
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
7:59 a.m.
Dear Friends,
I request you all to be calm. I assure you that FSF India board will respond.
We are trying to understand the recent developments.
Free Software is what matters more. That is what brings all of us together.
I am sure that FSF India board has the strength to accept its mistakes
and creative criticisms. It is a small organisation with limited resources.
It has weakness and strengths. I request all of you to restrain from
any kinds of flame wars.
regards,
arun
30 Sep
30 Sep
12:19 a.m.
2008/9/29 Vikram Vincent <vincentvikram(a)gmail.com>om>:
But you definitely owe me an apology. I did not expect
such cheapness from
you.
Sorry about that. It came from the warmth of working together for some
time. Like one yelling at a good friend when one is angry with. I
apologise sincerely for this. It was my mistake.
Hope we can leave it behind us and move forward to spread Software Freedom.
--
പ്രവീണ് അരിമ്പ്രത്തൊടിയില്
<GPLv2> I know my rights; I want my phone call!
<DRM> What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
(as seen on /.)
Join The DRM Elimination Crew Now!
http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Anti-DRM-Campaign
5475
days inactive
5477
days old
19 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
Anand Babu Periasamy -
Anivar Aravind -
Arun M -
Jack As -
Mani A -
Praveen A -
Raj Mathur -
renuka prasad -
Shyam Karanattu -
Vikram Vincent