24 Sep
2009
24 Sep
'09
8:12 a.m.
http://www.deccanherald.com/content/26913/free-software-suited-ui-card.html
There are compelling arguments to support the use of a free software, but
advocates of free software doubt if the government would decide on one,
given the money involved and the weight the companies owning proprietary
software carry. But use of proprietary system, they feel, would be
tantamount to compromising national security.
“A software can be termed as secure only if the freedom to examine or
modify the code lies with its user, in this case, the Government of India,”
proclaims the Free Software Movement of Karnataka (FSMK), a body that
supports use of free software and propagates its usage in various spheres of
activities.
Naturally, the movement finds Microsoft’s proposal to undertake the project
‘disturbing.’ While on one hand — a write up in the FSMK newsletter claims —
Microsoft’s involvement would sabotage a state’s, and by default its
citizen’s, right to control the software on which the most crucial data
would sit, it also paints an alarming picture of the IT giant’s associations
with the US government and slips in the suggestion that it would let the
Americans sabotage the whole network as a part of a cyber attack if things
come down to that.
26 Sep
26 Sep
5:45 a.m.
Naturally, the movement finds Microsoft’s proposal to undertake the project
‘disturbing.’ While on one hand — a write up in the FSMK newsletter claims —
Microsoft’s involvement would sabotage a state’s, and by default its
citizen’s, right to control the software on which the most crucial data
would sit, it also paints an alarming picture of the IT giant’s associations
with the US government and slips in the suggestion that it would let the
Americans sabotage the whole network as a part of a cyber attack if things
come down to that.
The article in Deccan Herald was based on something which FSMK said
and FSFMK was founded by one well known leftist sympathizer. No prizes
for guessing the name.
The article which you quoted from Deccan Herald itself says,
quote
If we exclude certain extremist portions of the FSMK’s case against
Microsoft, especially the erroneous portrayal of the IT company as an
arm of the US government and a dirty capitalist establishment, much of
its argument makes sense.
unquote
Why are you equating Microsoft = Americans/American Government ?
RMS is an American, so is EMS and so is Linus (at least these days)
and so are all the staff of FSF Boston and so are countless hackers ,
so are they all part of the 'American sabotage'. ?
One small request: Kindly keep Leftist/Communist propaganda off this list.
I am a FOSS software supporter from Cochin, Kerala and I find your
distorted argument that Freedom is something that the Americans are
about to steal from the rest of the world using Microsoft and your
quoting of FSFMK as nothing more than leftist propaganda and request
you to refrain from such fact distorting tactics on this list.
--
Vivek Varghese Cherian
Website : http://vivekvc.freeshell.org
Blog: http://vivekvc.wordpress.com
IRC: Vivek and ViveKVC on both Freenode and OFTC
GPG Key fingerprint: 0F53 447E A8D1 C4F7 C14E F117 A040 E935 7DFA D159
7:07 a.m.
Why are you equating Microsoft = Americans/American
Government ?
It is a well known fact that several USA based companies routinely put
in backdoors, other monitoring systems at the behest of the USA govt.
M$ is also an example.
Another popular example is the DES
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_Encryption_Standard
"The algorithm was initially controversial with classified design elements,
a relatively short key length, and suspicions about a National Security
Agency (NSA) backdoor."
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
http://fsmk.org/
7:12 a.m.
On Sat, 2009-09-26 at 12:37 +0530, Vikram Vincent wrote:
I think the analysis is pritty good but the words used are wrong. We
can't say "americans ". RMS is An American and so are many free
software developers, wellwishers and promoters.
So while it is true that some organisations like M$ might be used by the
american government for their bennifit against many countries, it is not
proper to generalise about this.
Happy hacking.
Krishnakant.
Why are you
equating Microsoft = Americans/American Government ?
It is a well known fact that several USA based companies routinely put
in backdoors, other monitoring systems at the behest of the USA govt.
M$ is also an example.
Another popular example is the DES
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_Encryption_Standard
"The algorithm was initially controversial with classified design elements,
a relatively short key length, and suspicions about a National Security
Agency (NSA) backdoor."
7:23 a.m.
2009/9/26 Krishnakant <krmane(a)gmail.com>om>:
I think the analysis is pritty good but the words used are wrong. We
can't say "americans ". RMS is An American and so are many free
software developers, wellwishers and promoters.
So while it is true that some organisations like M$ might be used by the
american government for their bennifit against many countries, it is not
proper to generalise about this.
As Prabir pointed out:
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: prabir <prabirp(a)gmail.com>
Date: 2009/9/26
Subject: Re: [fosscomm] Free software best suited for UI card project
To: Indian FOSS Community Network list <network(a)lists.fosscom.in>
Why are you equating Microsoft = Americans/American Government ?
RMS is an American, so is EMS and so is Linus (at least these days)
and so are all the staff of FSF Boston and so are countless hackers ,
so are they all part of the 'American sabotage'. ?
There is a simple distinction between Americans as people and American
companies. There is also a distinction of developing proprietary
software in which any back door as a security risk can be kept and
free and open source software, where such back doors would be
immediately known.
Any American company (also Chinese, British or from any other country)
has to observe the laws of the home country. The US Government has
restricted the 'strength' of cryptography which can be sent out of the
country.. The restrictions have not been removed (in 2007, it is still
illegal to export cryptographic software using key lengths greater
than 64-bits without authorization from the U.S. Bureau of Industry
and Security Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_size). This
allows the US Government agencies to crack encryption systems and is
the stated reason by the US Government for restricting the strength of
encryption software.
This restriction of course applies to all US companies and not M$ alone.
This problem is well known and certain defense related systems do not
use Windows for this reason in many countries including India.
In general, I would oppose the UID scheme for various reasons. But
M$'s involvement in such a project is doubly dangerous and is not the
same as Americans working on free software.
Prabir
--
Vikram Vincent
+919448810822
http://swatantra.org/
http://fsmk.org/
7:21 a.m.
On Sat, 2009-09-26 at 11:15 +0530, Vivek Varghese Cherian wrote:
We all know that m$ is a dirty capitalist wo does uses all dirty tactics
and does go against freedom.
Naturally, the movement finds Microsoft’s proposal to undertake the project
‘disturbing.’ While on one hand — a write up in the FSMK newsletter claims —
Microsoft’s involvement would sabotage a state’s, and by default its
citizen’s, right to control the software on which the most crucial data
would sit, it also paints an alarming picture of the IT giant’s associations
with the US government and slips in the suggestion that it would let the
Americans sabotage the whole network as a part of a cyber attack if things
come down to that.
The article in Deccan Herald was based on something which FSMK said
and FSFMK was founded by one well known leftist sympathizer. No prizes
for guessing the name.
The article which you quoted from Deccan Herald itself says,
quote
If we exclude certain extremist portions of the FSMK’s case against
Microsoft, especially the erroneous portrayal of the IT company as an
arm of the US government and a dirty capitalist establishment, much of
its argument makes sense.
unquote
Why are you equating Microsoft = Americans/American Government ?
Exactly. I think it is bad to genralise. We have very good FOSS supporters in America
as well.
RMS is an American, so is EMS and so is Linus (at
least these days)
and so are all the staff of FSF Boston and so are countless hackers ,
so are they all part of the 'American sabotage'. ?
Bingo!
One small request: Kindly keep Leftist/Communist
propaganda off this list.
I am a FOSS software supporter from Cochin, Kerala and I find your
distorted argument that Freedom is something that the Americans are
about to steal from the rest of the world using Microsoft and your
quoting of FSFMK as nothing more than leftist propaganda and request
you to refrain from such fact distorting tactics on this list.
Actually I would go one step ahead and say, not just leftist or
communist, we must keep all political party propaganda away from the
focul point, "Free Software ".
If there is a political party which gives free software such an
important place in their agenda, it is really welcome. But this should
not go beyond cooperating to work for the cause.
Happy hacking.
Krishnakant.
9:26 a.m.
.
like your direct style and just because you said this i cannot brand you politically as a
communist, though many people would ignorantly do so . btw you have been a inspiration for
many of us at fsmk. we love your video with elcot, chennai and especially the way the
question on 'thie'
unquote
We all know that m$ is a dirty capitalist wo does uses all
dirty tactics
and does go against freedom.
Actually I would go one step ahead and say, not just
leftist or
communist, we must keep all political party propaganda away
from the
focul point, "Free Software ".
If there is a political party which gives free software
such an
important place in their agenda, it is really
welcome. But this should
not go beyond cooperating to work for the cause.
"Protecting sovereignty with free software is a good idea and the duty of
governments, says Stallman". If fsmk said the same thing how would that become a
digression from free software.
We at fsmk are contributing like anybody else - ieee workshops on the kernel ,
volunteering for teachers workshops, web workshops, talking free software philosophy in
colleges and slum computing,
Yes we have been talking about the links between free software and digital divide, we have
been talking about the links between free software and sovereignty. Your talks on
accessibility has been an eye opener for us and we do talk about it to students .
I thought we would have an alliance and community at fosscomm and the expansion of debate
into these domains is only welcome for free software.
We do not hesitate to change our positions and explain - if we got something wrong - we do
believe in compiler errors , unit testing and churning out better code. We are kids
anyways compared to many veterans here. Do let us know. As of now the kids don't
really understand ;)
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6 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
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haynes davis -
Krishnakant -
Senthil S -
Vikram Vincent -
Vivek Varghese Cherian