Here is an interesting estimate:
http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl2516/stories/20080815251604100
But OSS related estimates are not included... and moreover the bodies like NASSCOM that provide data are basically agencies of foreign capital and have little to do with Open source.
Best
A. Mani
Mani A wrote:
Here is an interesting estimate:
http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl2516/stories/20080815251604100
May be the link is this one http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl2516/stories/20080815251404100.htm
But OSS related estimates are not included... and moreover the bodies like NASSCOM that provide data are basically agencies of foreign capital and have little to do with Open source.
From the article:
For example, two global software majors – Microsoft and SAP – registered revenue growth of 29 and 104 per cent respectively in the domestic market in 2007-08.The emerging picture is clear. Even while India’s scorching pace of I.T. services export growth slows, there are signs that foreign firms are increasing their presence in an increasingly concentrated I.T. sector. This has two implications. First, I.T. export revenues are increasingly being garnered by foreign firms. But more importantly, as the domestic market for I.T. hardware and software grows, fuelled by increased government expenditure aimed at increasing I.T. use, foreign firms are coming to dominate the rapidly growing domestic market for both hardware and software.
And sure its not because Companies like M$ Wants to "liberate" panchayati raj systems and the like by entering the government mechanisms..pumping in money to the "right" places..
Regards Shyam K
On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 7:55 PM, Shyam Karanattu mail@swathanthran.in wrote:
Mani A wrote:
Here is an interesting estimate:
http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl2516/stories/20080815251604100
May be the link is this one http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl2516/stories/20080815251404100.htm
But OSS related estimates are not included... and moreover the bodies like NASSCOM that provide data are basically agencies of foreign capital and have little to do with Open source.
From the article:
For example, two global software majors – Microsoft and SAP – registered revenue growth of 29 and 104 per cent respectively in the domestic market in 2007-08.The emerging picture is clear. Even while India's scorching pace of I.T. services export growth slows, there are signs that foreign firms are increasing their presence in an increasingly concentrated I.T. sector. This has two implications. First, I.T. export revenues are increasingly being garnered by foreign firms. But more importantly, as the domestic market for I.T. hardware and software grows, fuelled by increased government expenditure aimed at increasing I.T. use, foreign firms are coming to dominate the rapidly growing domestic market for both hardware and software.
And sure its not because Companies like M$ Wants to "liberate" panchayati raj systems and the like by entering the government mechanisms..pumping in money to the "right" places..
All of the non-left State Governments in India and the Central Govt are essentially being run by the big business and apart from the usual form of struggle, what can be done is to have the FLOSS operating system (along with required s/w for Panchayats) in place... so that adoption can start at the lowest level. I do not see why this is not done already. Surely the ones sitting in villages will find it more difficult to do all the adaptation themselves. The community model is always mighty. ... and above mistakes in policy.
Best
A. Mani
On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 10:59 PM, Mani A a.mani.cms@gmail.com wrote:
All of the non-left State Governments in India and the Central Govt are essentially being run by the big business and apart from the usual
.. could have been true at some point of time in history, Mani, definitely not now.
Its pointless to blame other governments, because they don't declare themselves to be followers of any particular ideology. There is no common concern in outlook of most such governments.
But wherever governments have been formed based on support from citizens after claiming to be representing a certain form of ideology, the trouble starts when those in power (a) stop listening to sensible messages coming from citizenry, (b) starts identifying themselves with the causes of elite corporates, (c) uses intellectual resources to compete with other political establishments/individuals, (d) design, develop and attempt to execute policies and projects discreetly, and (e) uses organised might to bulldoze counter-opinions.
Most people would be silent if, for instance, left-front rechristens itself to "neo-liberal revolutionary front for individuals" - because then there is no confusion - whatever then the new organisation does conforms to its ideological outlook - building individuals and not communities, helping corporates and not societies/communities, engaging in amusing/entertaining people deviating them from engaging with any political concerns. Its precisely this outlook that necessitates allocation of resources which currently antagonises ordinary people - resources like space, public funds, state's bureaucratic machinery, intellectual support to justify actions or to divert public attention etc
form of struggle, what can be done is to have the FLOSS operating system (along with required s/w for Panchayats) in place... so that adoption can start at the lowest level. I do not see why this is not done already. Surely the ones sitting in villages will find it more difficult to do all the adaptation themselves. The community model is always mighty. ... and above mistakes in policy.
Ordinary people are enlightened ones. They understand pretty fast. What you said is most apt. Go out and speak. Only an extremely vigilant community can help itself now.
Best wishes and regards, CK Raju
On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 10:05 AM, CK Raju ck.thrissur@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 10:59 PM, Mani A a.mani.cms@gmail.com wrote:
All of the non-left State Governments in India and the Central Govt are essentially being run by the big business and apart from the usual
.. could have been true at some point of time in history, Mani, definitely not now.
Its pointless to blame other governments, because they don't declare themselves to be followers of any particular ideology. There is no common concern in outlook of most such governments.
They certainly determine, most of what seems to exist and does not seem to.
Most people would be silent if, for instance, left-front rechristens itself to "neo-liberal revolutionary front for individuals" - because then there is no confusion - whatever then the new organisation does conforms to its ideological outlook - building individuals and not
The Left has never really been in a position to implement 'truly leftist' policies. They do admit that and their essential policy is one of minimizing damage in the present circumstances... beginning from accepting to play democracy in a capitalist democracy and right up to the hilarious 'we will prefer manufacturing units of corporates to global money lenders'. Yes of course there is plenty of room for debate. Marx did say that ideology must be flexible enough to deal with the circumstances in question. (You can see a forum like Pragoti for debates on such issues. They had a long debate on unions for IT employees and policy recently)
form of struggle, what can be done is to have the FLOSS operating system (along with required s/w for Panchayats) in place... so that adoption can start at the lowest level. I do not see why this is not done already. Surely the ones sitting in villages will find it more difficult to do all the adaptation themselves. The community model is always mighty. ... and above mistakes in policy.
Ordinary people are enlightened ones. They understand pretty fast. What you said is most apt. Go out and speak. Only an extremely vigilant community can help itself now.
Best
A. Mani
On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 9:05 PM, Mani A a.mani.cms@gmail.com >>> All of the non-left State Governments in India and the Central Govt
are essentially being run by the big business and apart from the usual
.. could have been true at some point of time in history, Mani, definitely not now.
Its pointless to blame other governments, because they don't declare themselves to be followers of any particular ideology. There is no common concern in outlook of most such governments.
They certainly determine, most of what seems to exist and does not seem to.
My point was that left governments today are never far off from non-left governments. In certain cases, it had been left which had blundered, allowing non-left govts to push harder on similar lines. Microsoft, Pepsi, Cola etc all got their foothold in respectable positions because of shady dealings of left governments, in states like Kerala and Bengal. Left had lost much of its moral positions because of such indulgences, at highest levels of democracy which it enjoyed (one must acknowledge that at lower layers of governance, things are pretty different - there are far too many sincere people around).
Most people would be silent if, for instance, left-front rechristens itself to "neo-liberal revolutionary front for individuals" - because
The Left has never really been in a position to implement 'truly leftist' policies. They do admit that and their essential policy is
But they were really in a position to implement extreme "right-ist" policies - whenever they got an opportunity to deal with big corporates. SEZs are living testimony to this - an area where markets enjoy unbridled freedom and unrestrained mobility to act and function on its own. A trade minister in Kerala recently said he's implementing SEZs primarily because he wants the world to know that the left is no longer against SEZs. How can any sensible person decode it differently ?
one of minimizing damage in the present circumstances... beginning from accepting to play democracy in a capitalist democracy and right up to the hilarious 'we will prefer manufacturing units of corporates to global money lenders'. Yes of course there is plenty of room for debate. Marx did say that ideology must be flexible enough to deal with the circumstances in question. (You can see a forum like Pragoti for debates on such issues. They had a long debate on unions for IT employees and policy recently)
Debates are good, but are those in power ever involved in such debates? Sensible people debate, lesser sensible ones decide-and-implement discreetly - why do they need to debate, when they already have freedom and power to do anything without it ?
One recalls the earlier era of human civilisation where large sections of people were involved in enchanting the world, with a view to control the powers of the universe. This era continued till people and scientists came forward to establish that universe had its own laws and is thoroughly purposeless and directionless. May be a renaissance is round the corner now, to convince the people in governance who are increasingly indulging in such *enchanting of the development mantra* to convince them that citizens of the entire world are united against their assault-moves.
Free Software, in that sense, shows a unhindered way of participation by those willing and in a direction that is tended to be away from corporate-culture - one driven by selfish interest, greed and profit-motive.
CK Raju
On Thursday 25 Sep 2008, CK Raju wrote:
[snip] Free Software, in that sense, shows a unhindered way of participation by those willing and in a direction that is tended to be away from corporate-culture - one driven by selfish interest, greed and profit-motive.
Isn't that going a bit too far? While I agree that selfish interest and the rest are undesirable qualities (at least in others ;) , attributing those qualities to all corporates is a bit extreme.
After all, Sun and Red Hat (both large corporates) employees have played an invaluable role in keeping software patents away from us so far.
Regards,
-- Raju
On Thu, Sep 25, 2008 at 5:26 PM, CK Raju ck.thrissur@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 9:05 PM, Mani A a.mani.cms@gmail.com >>> All of the non-left State Governments in India and the Central Govt
are essentially being run by the big business and apart from the usual
Its pointless to blame other governments, because they don't declare themselves to be followers of any particular ideology. There is no common concern in outlook of most such governments.
They certainly determine, most of what seems to exist and does not seem to.
My point was that left governments today are never far off from non-left governments. In certain cases, it had been left which had blundered, allowing non-left govts to push harder on similar lines. Microsoft, Pepsi, Cola etc all got their foothold in respectable positions because of shady dealings of left governments, in states like Kerala and Bengal. Left had lost much of its moral positions
The performance of the left Govts has been good, despite the right-wing media propaganda.
A state Government has hardly any constitutional right to stop the corporate forces. The left is free to organize strikes, bandhs and rallies and more. But the economy has already been completely handed over to the MNCs by successive Central Govts.
This is going OT.
because of such indulgences, at highest levels of democracy which it enjoyed (one must acknowledge that at lower layers of governance, things are pretty different - there are far too many sincere people around).
Most people would be silent if, for instance, left-front rechristens itself to "neo-liberal revolutionary front for individuals" - because
The Left has never really been in a position to implement 'truly leftist' policies. They do admit that and their essential policy is
But they were really in a position to implement extreme "right-ist" policies - whenever they got an opportunity to deal with big corporates. SEZs are living testimony to this - an area where markets enjoy unbridled freedom and unrestrained mobility to act and function on its own. A trade minister in Kerala recently said he's implementing SEZs primarily because he wants the world to know that the left is no longer against SEZs. How can any sensible person decode it differently ?
On SEZs, different parts of the left have different sets of recommendations. This has been a heavily debated in all places... this mailing list is NOT SUITABLE for debates on SEZs .
one of minimizing damage in the present circumstances... beginning from accepting to play democracy in a capitalist democracy and right
Debates are good, but are those in power ever involved in such debates? Sensible people debate, lesser sensible ones decide-and-implement discreetly - why do they need to debate, when they already have freedom and power to do anything without it ?
State Governments in India have little power in their hands. It is the Central Government that dictates. The Left certainly debates all the issues involved at all levels of their organizations and outside too.
For the petit bourgeois, bourgeois and some other classes, should they acquire mass media channels and give the FEELING of debate like the corporates do?
<snip>
Free Software, in that sense, shows a unhindered way of participation by those willing and in a direction that is tended to be away from corporate-culture - one driven by selfish interest, greed and profit-motive.
The free software movement is one of the many essential ways, but what you said about scientists does not look all right.
Best
A. Mani
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CK Raju -
Mani A -
Raj Mathur -
Shyam Karanattu