Hi All, I am calling "free software" as "freedom software" these days. This is to emphasize that we are talking about freedoms, this way I am able to avoid the idiom ``free'' as in ``free speech,'' not as in ``free beer.'', and I hope that the idiom will become unnecessary.
Does anybody have an opinion on this? Unless I hear good reasons for why it should be otherwise, I will be using "freedom software" when I try and explain free software movement.
Also in written communication, I am writing "Free(dom)" instead of "Free", should I just be using "Freedom". Please let me know.
RMS, if you are reading this. Do you have any opinion on this usage?
This is particularly important for me, since I am starting to give talks on Free Software Movement, (to friends mostly, in Bay Area, California, USA). The title of the next talk is "Freedom, Development and Justice in the context of Free(dom) Software Movement"
Thanks Krishna
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--- Krishna Pagadala krishnaact@yahoo.com wrote: > Hi All,
I am calling "free software" as "freedom software" these days. This is to emphasize that we are talking about freedoms, this way I am able to avoid the idiom ``free'' as in ``free speech,'' not as in ``free beer.'', and I hope that the idiom will become unnecessary.
Does anybody have an opinion on this? Unless I hear good reasons for why it should be otherwise, I will be using "freedom software" when I try and explain free software movement.
Also in written communication, I am writing "Free(dom)" instead of "Free", should I just be using "Freedom". Please let me know.
RMS, if you are reading this. Do you have any opinion on this usage?
This is particularly important for me, since I am starting to give talks on Free Software Movement, (to friends mostly, in Bay Area, California, USA). The title of the next talk is "Freedom, Development and Justice in the context of Free(dom) Software Movement"
I am using Free(dom) term for nearly two years in all my talks in schools/colleges and organisations. I found it convenient and the message is driven easily.
Raman.P
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Raman.P wrote on Mon, Dec 29, 2003 at 06:54:10AM +0000: ,---- | I am using Free(dom) term for nearly two years in all my talks in | schools/colleges and organisations. I found it convenient and the | message is driven easily. `----
Very correct. Free(dom) software drives the right message without having to explain a hundred things. Students are more enthusiastic about "seeing" things. It is enough if we show them all that they can do with Free software (extensibility, studying the code, etc.,.) and they will get hooked up easily.
cheers,
-Suraj
Interestingly, I know a very elderly person (70+ years) who had attended the Freedom First conference in Thiruvananthapuram and has used the term Freedom Software ever since. Being an economist with no technological inclinations, he is not at all aware of the technical details of the software, but was impressed with the message of freedom that RMS conveyed. It is, perhaps, this that put the term 'Freedom Software' in his mind. I had tried to correct him initially, but that appeared to escape his mind the next time he spoke. So I let it remain.
Regards V. Sasi Kumar
On Mon, 2003-12-29 at 11:16, Krishna Pagadala wrote:
Hi All, I am calling "free software" as "freedom software" these days. This is to emphasize that we are talking about freedoms, this way I am able to avoid the idiom ``free'' as in ``free speech,'' not as in ``free beer.'', and I hope that the idiom will become unnecessary.
Does anybody have an opinion on this? Unless I hear good reasons for why it should be otherwise, I will be using "freedom software" when I try and explain free software movement.
Also in written communication, I am writing "Free(dom)" instead of "Free", should I just be using "Freedom". Please let me know.
RMS, if you are reading this. Do you have any opinion on this usage?
This is particularly important for me, since I am starting to give talks on Free Software Movement, (to friends mostly, in Bay Area, California, USA). The title of the next talk is "Freedom, Development and Justice in the context of Free(dom) Software Movement"
Thanks Krishna
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Interesting to know this. I will be talking to a non technical audience. After the talk I think they will remember "Freedom Software". From now on, in all my activist efforts I will be saying "Freedom Software". Does the FSF have a supporting opinion? I would like to know what FSF and RMS think about this.
Thanks KRishna
--- "V. Sasi Kumar" vsasi@vsnl.com wrote:
Interestingly, I know a very elderly person (70+ years) who had attended the Freedom First conference in Thiruvananthapuram and has used the term Freedom Software ever since. Being an economist with no technological inclinations, he is not at all aware of the technical details of the software, but was impressed with the message of freedom that RMS conveyed. It is, perhaps, this that put the term 'Freedom Software' in his mind. I had tried to correct him initially, but that appeared to escape his mind the next time he spoke. So I let it remain.
Regards V. Sasi Kumar
On Mon, 2003-12-29 at 11:16, Krishna Pagadala wrote:
Hi All, I am calling "free software" as "freedom
software"
these days. This is to emphasize that we are
talking
about freedoms, this way I am able to avoid the
idiom
``free'' as in ``free speech,'' not as in ``free beer.'', and I hope that the idiom will become unnecessary.
Does anybody have an opinion on this? Unless I
hear
good reasons for why it should be otherwise, I
will be
using "freedom software" when I try and explain
free
software movement.
Also in written communication, I am writing "Free(dom)" instead of "Free", should I just be
using
"Freedom". Please let me know.
RMS, if you are reading this. Do you have any opinion on this usage?
This is particularly important for me, since I
am
starting to give talks on Free Software Movement,
(to
friends mostly, in Bay Area, California, USA). The title of the next talk is "Freedom, Development and Justice in the context
of
Free(dom) Software Movement"
Thanks Krishna
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-- V. Sasi Kumar vsasi@vsnl.com CESS
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Krishna Pagadala wrote:
I am calling "free software" as "freedom software" these days. ... Does anybody have an opinion on this? Unless I hear good reasons for why it should be otherwise, I will be using "freedom software" when I try and explain free software movement.
Dear Mr. Krishna Pagadala,
"Freedom software" is incorrect, because "freedom" is a noun form derived from the adjective "free", and therefore the word "freedom" cannot be used to qualify the noun "software". Proper nouns are sometimes used as proper adjectives, but freedom is a common noun, and does not qualify as a proper adjective.
The free software movement has a long history now, and it is inappropriate to invent new phrases for a well known and widely used expression that clearly points to software released under the GPL and like free licenses. Please do visit www.gnu.org for details. For more Light on Free Software, please read the postings so titled at http://www.gnu.org.in/pipermail/fsf-friends/2003-November/ . The posting titled "Free without ambiguity and overapplicability" exclusively dealt with the usage of the word free in Free Software. A Free Software International Treaty was suggested, so that state legislations, and all users would use the free software terminology more widely and uniformly throughout the world.
Kindly use the expression "free software", saving Free Software from do(o)m ;-)
Regards, K. Ramanraj.
"Freedom software" is incorrect, because "freedom" is a noun form derived from the adjective "free", and therefore the word "freedom" cannot be used to qualify the noun "software". Proper nouns are sometimes used as proper adjectives, but freedom is a common noun, and does not qualify as a proper adjective.
Are the following ungramatical? 1) "Freedom Rides" 2) "Freedom Train" 3) "Freedom Bus" All of the above were used in the civil rights movement USA. Choice of words must convey a message, and if gramatical rules need to be broken, so be it.
The free software movement has a long history now, and it is inappropriate to invent new phrases for a well known and widely used expression that clearly points to software released under the GPL and like free licenses.
True, for the technical community who already know about GNU/FSF. But I want to be able to talk to people who have no clue about software, and freedom is the word that resonates most easily. Also "free software" is only a part of the free software movement. I think the philosophy of FSM is more important. I want people to be thinking in terms of freedoms lost when using closed software, and more importantly to think about the bigger issue of copyright. Read Misinterpreting Copyright by Richard Stallman http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/misinterpreting-copyright.html
Thanks Krishna
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Krishna Pagadala wrote:
Are the following ungramatical?
- "Freedom Rides"
- "Freedom Train"
- "Freedom Bus"
All of the above were used in the civil rights movement USA. Choice of words must convey a message, and if gramatical rules need to be broken, so be it.
If you treat Freedom as a Proper Adjective then it would mean that the software you use is a device for enforcing civil rights and nothing else. One could rightfully use free software for making civil rights a reality, and further put it to good use in many, many other areas. Please read my posting to this list titled "GNU Freedom could become the mother of all freedoms" in this regard. [available at: http://gnu.org.in/pipermail/fsf-friends/2003-September/001190.html ] If you ever write a lexical parser using flex, bison or any other free software, that could check constitutionality of code, then you could legitimately call it Freedom Software: A piece of code that makes your constitutional rights a reality. A text editor that only edits what code you write, could be referred to only a free software and not as Freedom Software.
The free software movement has a long history now, and it is inappropriate to invent new phrases for a well known and widely used expression that clearly points to software released under the GPL and like free licenses.
True, for the technical community who already know about GNU/FSF. But I want to be able to talk to people who have no clue about software, and freedom is the word that resonates most easily.
The free software movement greatly obliterates the line between technical community and general users, with the availability of source code, and free documentation, that could be understood by a mature student of High School, who can take the time and effort for it. Using the right terminology from the start is very important and would make all the difference in taking the free software movement forward with more vigour and strength.
Also "free software" is only a part of the free software movement. I think the philosophy of FSM is more important.
Absolutely. We share our thoughts here only because of our deep conviction about the truth and validity of the philosophy behind the free software movement.
I want people to be thinking in terms of freedoms lost when using closed software, and more importantly to think about the bigger issue of copyright.
.. please use copyleft ;-)
The luggies at ILUGC sent "Happy GNU Year" postings. I freely copy and modify the same, to wish you all - A very Happy, Prosperous and Eventful GNU Year (:-)) During the course of this year, you should be able to freely use .^.Calpp to track your events and prosperity, and give me feedback if it made you happy ;-)
.^. Calpp is an acronym for computer aided legal procedures and proceedings. Now, simply because it sounds like something to do wholly with the law, please don't ignore it. Development of free software has in many ways been influenced by the law - including copyright law, corporate ambitions expressed in tightly worded licenses, lawyers, courts and legislatures. Charles Babbage had a long innings with the British Parliament. My fortune for one morning was:
"On two occasions I have been asked [by members of Parliament!], `Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." -- Charles Babbage
[Source: fortune, usually at /usr/share/fortune/fortunes ] More about the life and works of Charles Babbage are available at http://fourmilab.ch/babbage Any study about the history of computers- both hardware and software would take us back to 1830's, the times of Charles Babbage. While at http://fourmilab.ch , one may also read "Hacker's Diet", by John Walker, and that would be a healthy way to start the New Year.
The GNU Project history documents the travails of RMS with copyright licenses, and how FSF has overcome the helplessness of people whose hands were tied by restrictive licenses. FreeBSD and NetBSD were literally born out of the legal conflicts between freedom to share software and the frustrative restrictive corporate licenses. Free For All documents the free software history in an interesting narrative, and is available at: http://www.wayner.org/books/ffa/
The law has played an important role in the development of free software. I guess it will continue to do so. I set out to just mind my business with Calpp, but it has taken me to strange new areas like artificial intelligence. When I wrote once to RMS about Calpp, he replied:
If this includes implementation of human-style common-sense reasoning, you may have tackled a problem that the Artificial Intelligence field has been struggling with for 35 years.
After that, I knew, that Calpp is required for AI. The systematic storage of laws - both man made, and our discoveries about the rules governing nature - are required for AI to work well for us. My immediate desire is to use Calpp to let law flow through free software, but if it paves way for robust AI, it should be another welcome development in the free software world, again with aid of the law!
We all know that GNU kicked off the movement of "free software" with the GPL licensing terms.This licence made sure that any piece of software distributed under GPL will remain "free". Thus GPL has a social control over the commercial exploitation a product which is developed by collective effort and shared knowledge.
Therefore I think the term 'GNUware' may be used in place of "free software". The "GNU" part serves as link to those who hear it for the first time. Let us hope that the BSD people won't complain ;-)
Other suggestions are "peoples' software" and "social software"
SURESH
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p.suresh said on Sun, Jan 11, 2004 at 09:02:41PM +0100,:
'GNUware' may be used in place of "free software". The "GNU" part serves as link to those who hear it for the first time.
But then, non-Gnu free software exists.
Gnu is a project. Not all free software is under the GNU project. The OpenOffice.org suite, for example.
-
Krishna Pagadala -
Mahesh T. Pai -
p.suresh -
Raman.P -
Ramanraj K -
Suraj -
V. Sasi Kumar