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Re: [ILUG-BOM] WinXp Vs Linux
by sherlock＠vsnl.com 02 Apr '05

02 Apr '05

On Saturday 02 April 2005 11:05, Devdas Bhagat wrote: > > >In effect the commercial distros companies are providing > > > expertise not just software and they are fully justified in > > > charging what ever they please. And you can have a completely > > > legal parasitic existence by the above methods. In fact you can > > > provide better services and charge more (after RTFM) than them. > > >rgds > > >jtd > > > A couple of points that you appear to have missed. > The GPL concerns itself with source code. Not binaries, not > support, nothing else. Nope. You are eliminating the case of derived work. It does concern itself with binaries too. A binary is a derived work of the source - as are modifications, bugfixes, enhancements etc. Therefore the terms of the gpl apply to the binaries too. Also "distributing" includes putting a binary into a flash rom and sticking it inside your gizmo and selling the gizmo. (I had too do some talking with some distributors of embedded products here on this issue.) This action (selling the gizmo) is distribution and requires gpl compliance. Therfore source code must be made available. You can make copies of the binary hex file from the prom and use as you deem fit without any copyright violation. Even if "opening this parcel means that you agree" to whatever. The reason is that the gpl licence has given you a right the moment the act of giving and taking takes place. Adding wrappers - physical or software does not change the fact of distribution. There is no way that anyone (RH, Novell, Microsod whoever) can circumvent this - thank god. > > Linux distributors take the GPLed source, package it, build it into > binaries, and test those. > That is a service. RedHat et al charge for that service. > > When you "buy" RedHat ES/AS versions, you are paying for their > compiling and testing services, not for the software itself. This > _support_ purchase is a contract, which states that you may not > install the software from those binaries on more than one system. That is a violation of the gpl and will not stand in a law court. I have not read the contract but if you have one please post it. We can takeon redhat on this. The binary IS a derived work of the source. If the source is gpld so is the binary. > It has no conditions on the sources, other than the license the > code shipped with (GPL/MPL/anything else). > > RedHat will not stop you from building your own > RPMs from source, and installing those, so long as you do not > redistribute RedHats trademarked material along with those. If the logo is part of the binary there could be a potential problem as you cannot compile in non gpl code along with gpld code. I am not sure that the logo = code. My guess is that the court will rule in favour of the logo and hold cloners liable if they do not remove the logo. Which IMO is very fair to the trademark holders. > > If you do not want to pay RedHat, you can download their source > RPMs and then build your own distribution. When you are doing so, > you have to remove RedHats trademarks and logos, since you are not > RedHat. You can replace those with your own logos if you want. > > Also, there is generally no non-copyrighted material in a Linux > distribution. All the software is copyright to its author(s). > > > organisation for full driver support and manual reference. I am > > not against companies that charge or make money. I try my best to > > encourage people to buy legal software and did manage to convince > > a few. I use legal software in my comps even though its very easy > > to use the pirated ones. What I don't like is the unnecessary > > hype about linux being free > > Linux itself is free to redistribute, as source code. And binaries too as binary=derivative of source. rgds jtd

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] WinXp Vs Linux
by sherlock＠vsnl.com 02 Apr '05

02 Apr '05

On Friday 01 April 2005 00:48, Rony Bill wrote: > > Dear Jude, > > Your tone of writing reminded me of these words that appeared in > the Asian Age on 28th March. "It is only imperfection that > complains of what is imperfect. The more perfect we are, the more > gentle and quiet we become towards the defects of others"--Joseph > Addison. > > If you have the capacity to be polite then I would like to get one > doubt cleared. Never ever claimed to be perfect - that is why i read manpages and licenceses before clicking "I agree". And i am most certainly politness challenged. So there. > Can any commercial linux distro be copied and > installed in a commercial or corporate organisation? Is that > installation considered a valid legal and liscenced copy? All software (including copies) distributed under the GPL (and several other licences like /QPL/Mozilla/BSD etc afaik) licences are 100% legal and valid. You can use such copies any way you please including charging a zillion dollars for the copy. What you cant do with the gpl is prevent the recepient from 1) making copies and distributing the same. 2) making changes to the software Also you have to make avaialble at no additional charge except the cost of media the source code for the software INCLUDING ANY CHANGES OR DERIVATIVES YOU MAKE to such gpld code. So you can buy a "licenced" version of a "commercial" distro like RH and buy a cd franking plant and frank a zillion copies and sell em. The exception is that 1) You will have to remove trade marks like redhat, RH etc. and put your own Gandhi topee if u please. 2) Remove software having EULAS (eg winmodem, NVIDIA drivers) 3) You cannot copy the manuals which have exclusive (as in you are excluded from coying rights) copyrights. The term "licence" and "commercial" is a red herring planted by the likes of RH, Trolltech and a few others who would like to confuse you into believing that gpl software not traded for cash is not commercial. Grep the list for eariler posts on this issue. Any GNU/Linux distro or gpl softaware is commercial if it is traded for something of value (including barter of cds). So buy one "commercial" copy and copy and sell to hearts content. When you buy support you will get access to a fast server and / or email / phone support so that you can patch and maintain the stuff better. You can then make copies of the patch ad nauseum and offer the same to your clients. In effect the commercial distros companies are providing expertise not just software and they are fully justified in charging what ever they please. And you can have a completely legal parasitic existence by the above methods. In fact you can provide better services and charge more (after RTFM) than them. So then happy legal copying and installing of RH, Suse, whatever. If you ask me i would tell you to use Debian and avoid the pain trying to remove logos while simultaneously not providing word of mouth advertising and a ready-to-eat client to your competitor. rgds jtd

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] File Locking using smbmount
by Keith Fernandez 02 Apr '05

02 Apr '05

Rishi wrote > However, the Linux client computers use smbmount to > map the shares within their home folders, which do not > lock the files... so when two users on the network try to access the same file, the contents of the file will be that > of the person that saved the file the last. I think the application that you use(for e.g. kwrite..) also need's to understand File locking capabilities, which is present in Office in windows. What application do you use to access the file? For e.g. Notepad in windows will not have file locking capabilities. Regards, Keith -------------------------- Reliance IDC DAKC Navi Mumbai 022-30374188 -------------------------- Disclaimer: This message is for the designated recipient only and may contain privileged, proprietary, or otherwise private information. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete the original. Any other use of the email by you is prohibited

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File Locking using smbmount
by Rishi 02 Apr '05

02 Apr '05

Hi I have a Samba Server on RH9 and when I map the shares on Windows client computers, the files are locked so the users do not accidentally overwrite other people's files on the network. (This is the good news) However, the Linux client computers use smbmount to map the shares within their home folders, which do not lock the files... so when two users on the network try to access the same file, the contents of the file will be that of the person that saved the file the last. I've looked at the man page of smbmount to see if I can enable file locking at the client level .... no joy. Any tips on how to fix this? Thanks Rishi

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Re: GPL [Was: Re: [ILUG-BOM] WinXp Vs Linux]
by sherlock＠vsnl.com 02 Apr '05

02 Apr '05

On Saturday 02 April 2005 06:31, Srinivasan Krishnan wrote: > JT, > > While we've discussed this earlier, I'd like your view on the > following, from the DansGuardian website: > > <snip> > For all non-commercial[1] use DansGuardian 2 can be downloaded > under the GPL. For all non-commercial use I grant the end-user > permission to download DansGuardian 2. Upon your downloading of > DansGuardian 2 for non-commercial use I license it under the GPL. > > For all commercial[2] use, upon your downloading, DansGuardian 2 is > licensed under the GPL, however permission to download DansGuardian > from this, or any mirror[3], website is restricted. Ya! I read this earlier. And it's a very red herring. Once you have a gpld copy you can do exactly as you please including selling it COMMERCIALLY. Downloading from HIS website or the mirrors which have similiar restrictions may not be allowed (BW costs money). But I can setup a mirror with a gpld copy and offer it for money (or gratis) to all and sundry. The para below is clear as smoke glass. And you are partly correct in that the bugfixes are paid for downloads. But once you get em they are gpld as it is very obviously a derivate of gpld software. So distribute to your hearts content. > > The restrictions on the downloading for commercial use are that you > may only download it once for free. This will enable you to try out > the software before making a decision to purchase a commercial > licence to download it. In order to download updates, bug fixes, > etc, you must purchase a download licence. > </snip> > > Based on your interpretation (which I believe to be correct), how > does he get away with this? The only thing I can think of is that > the changes, bug fixes etc. that he mentions are not GPL'd and will > not be posted for free download. Which again is probably not a > huge deal even for a non-programmer, since they would generally be > rolled into the next release. ALL bugfixes of gpld software are automatically derived works (you cant have a bug fix standing by itself) and the gpl applies automatically. If he gives you a copy (It is perfectly legal to not give any one a copy eg. google uses modified gnu stuff but does not distribute it to any one) you can freakout with it . > > Also, if for commercial use DansGuardian gets licenced under the > GPL on the first download, I should be able to make and dstribute > (sell, give away, whatever) as many copies as I wish. Then where > do his stated restrictions on commercial use apply? There is no restriction. Like I said this is a red herring and the author cannot take legal action. > > > So buy one "commercial" copy and copy and sell to hearts content. > > When you buy support you will get access to a fast server and / > > or email / phone support so that you can patch and maintain the > > stuff better. You can then make copies of the patch ad nauseum > > and offer the same to your clients. > > This licence seems funny to me. Is there more to this than is > obvious? Nope. Just smoke and mirrors to trick the less informed into making a purchase. rgds jtd

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Ubuntu/apt-get vs Fedora/yum
by Revant 02 Apr '05

02 Apr '05

I dont want a fight here, I want to configure yum better if possible When i installed fedora, it had wide range of software on cds, so for that I will prefer fedora But when I started yum for first time according to fedora FAQ. it takes hours apt-get does apt-get update in just 5 mins Whats the difference and why does yum costs time and apt-get is faster?

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Invitation
by Sajidali Baig 01 Apr '05

01 Apr '05

Sajidali Baig has invited you to join hi5. By joining hi5, you will be connected to Sajidali and all of Sajidali's friends. hi5 is the place where friends meet. You can use hi5 for the following purposes: * Find old friends * Meet new people * Browse photos Join Sajidali, meet Sajidali's friends, and meet people that share your interests now! Click here: http://www.hi5.com/register/LB8NM?inviteId=U3ON6NLNEX17233116l360928358 This invitation was sent to linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in on behalf of Sajidali Baig (sajidalibaig(a)gmail.com). If you do not wish to receive invitations from hi5 members, click on the link below: http://www.hi5.com/friend/displayBlockInvite.do?inviteId=<#randomId#>

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Fwd: [bcslug] Fergusson Linux released!
by Amit Karpe 01 Apr '05

01 Apr '05

-- param vaibhavam netum etat swaraashtram samrthaa bhavatwaashishaa tebhrusham || Bharat Maata Ki Jay ||

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Ark Linux 2005.1-SR1 Released
by Gaurav Mishra 01 Apr '05

01 Apr '05

This is a bug fix release of Ark Linux 2005.1: "Ark Linux 2005.1-SR1, a bugfix release of Ark Linux 2005.1, has been released. Mostly due to our lack of test hardware and testers, a couple of bugs worth fixing immediately managed to get into Ark Linux 2005.1 - based on user feedback, we have made a Service Release to address them and add some commonly requested features. ... The following features have been added: newly installed machines automatically retrieve network settings from DHCP servers (if there is one); DHCP enabled network interfaces no longer delay the boot up process if no DHCP server is found; support for Zeroconf support has been added; the X.Org Composite extension, allowing to use real transparent windows, is now enabled....

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] WinXp Vs Linux
by sherlock＠vsnl.com 01 Apr '05

01 Apr '05

On Wednesday 30 March 2005 17:42, Rony Bill wrote: Please do read the gpl. > I was refering to the present situation, not the past. SuSe's site > has a free version as well as other paid versions. RHEL as you > mention is a paid distro. The free versions are like 'personal' > editions whereas the ones for businesses are more featured and paid > for. What exactly does this stupid statement mean. I could give you a hundred very sound reasons for the "Missing features", but dont want to bore the whole list (as it would involve collating your past posts which cribbed about ease of use etc.). > Is SuSe Professional 9 or above, a freeware software like SuSe > personal? By branded distros I am refering to popular brands like > RedHat, SuSe, Mandrake and the likes. Is it legal to copy and use > as many times, paid-for linux versions? The most popular in terms of installed user base is Debian. The gpl allows you to make as many copies of any gpld software and use it in any fashion you please. The only restrictions is that you cannot change the terms of the gpl. And if you care to read, the commercial distros come with manuals and support. You are paying for the manual and support. They may also include some closed source drivers, which are distributed on different terms (eg. the winmodem drivers). There is no restriction on your downloading the distro for free or obtaining the same by any means available to you. You are however prevented from using the brand name of some distros. Quite obviously if the Company is spending money on creating a brand equity for it self I see no reason why some free loader should be allowed to exploit it's brand image. Particularly by someone ignorant enough to not know what the gpl is about let alone other things more complex. rgds jtd

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[Commercial] Job Opening
by Mike Ward 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

Hello, JR Technologies is looking for a web developer in the Bombay area. JR Technologies is a US based company that does web development and technologies solutions for international airfare consolidators. We're looking for someone with basic knowledge of Perl, MySQL, Linux usage and administration, XHTML/HTML, and Javascript. Experience in the travel industry is a bonus, but not a requirement. Please send all resumes/inquiries to vinay(a)skybird-travel.com -- Mike Ward Web Developer, Sky Bird Travel mike(a)skybird-travel.com (248) 372-4800, Ext. 222

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Sorry............
by Sajid ali Baig 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

hi, This is an apology for the "hi5 invitation" message sent by me by mistake. I beg your pardon regards

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INDIA-Thunderbird-1.0.2 is now available in Gujarati
by Frederick Noronha (FN) 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Thunderbird-1.0.2 is now available in Gujarati. Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:15:10 -0800 (PST) From: ankit patel <ankit644(a)yahoo.com> To: mozilla-l10n(a)mozilla.org Hi, I have localised Thunderbird-1.0.2 into Gujarati. So can somebody update it on mozilla.org status page. Please follow the link:- http://indianoss.sf.net/downloads.html Thank You! Ankit Patel Flosstoday mailing list Flosstoday(a)sarai.net https://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/flosstoday

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URGENT REQUIREMENT of Software Developer LAMP (Linux / Apache / MySQL / PHP)
by Anand Sharma 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

Senior Software Developer Job Description Candidate should be exceptionally good in LAMP (Linux / Apache / MySQL / PHP). Should be able to work in fast-paced environment with changing priorities. Able to work under pressure. Should be capable of delivering high quality products by good software engineering principles. Duties include Analysis and design of Object Oriented Systems Development, Enhancement and Integration of Web Applications. Documenting the project deliverables during various phases Desired Job Profile General Experience: - Web Application Development experience - 3 Years experience in PHP scripting - 2+ years in designing large scale software systems using Object Oriented Techniques - Documenting system architecture and design Candidate must be expert in following technology area: - Development of web application development with PHP on Linux. - Experience with Apache application server - MySQL database development - Experience in open source is preferred. - Should have good communication skills & learning aptit **Minimum Experience : 3 - 5 years Qualification – must be a literate. People who are intrested may call me offline Hemal Shah - 9821843567

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WinXp Vs Linux
by Raj Shaz 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

Im submiting papers to my admin authority for usage of FLOSS.To start the battle , i want to convince them to use GNU/Linux instead of WinXP. Can someone through light on cost estimate for single machine using WinXP + Office and another using GNU/Linux WinXP cost somewhere around Rs 6000 single machine licensing ( im not sure ) .Can someone point to some relevant data. Google dint helped me much... any other points for paper is most welcomed Raj

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IPCop Firewall 1.4.5 Released
by Gaurav Mishra 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

IPCop Firewall has been updated to version 1.4.5: "This is v1.4.5 release version. As usual, this version can be installed as an update from previous v1.4.x versions or with a ready-to-go ISO for a fresh install. Install update and restart connection to make the new dnsmasq version run. Short changes summary: fix pulsardsl by using the correct gcc3 lib; fix vpn missing lines in ipsec.conf; fix dhcpc.cgi with start and end address comparison; upgrade dnsmasq to 2.21; update snort sid URL; start a new online help system in portfw.cgi."

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Berry Linux Live cd 0.56 Released
by Gaurav Mishra 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

A new version of the Berry Linux live CD has been released. The most significant change is that Berry has switched to Unionfs files system, which means that users can now "save" files while the CD is in use. Several packages have been upgraded to newer versions, including KDE 3.4.0, K3b 0.11.22, Mozilla 1.7.6 and Firefox 1.0.2 (English and Japanese editions). Get it at http://berry.sourceforge.jp/berry-0.56.iso

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Annvix Server based Linux Released
by Gaurav Mishra 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

Annvix is a server-oriented Linux distribution based on Mandrakelinux, with many security enhancements. A lot of work has gone into Annvix to make it a lean, slim, and powerful server operating system. As a result, there is no GUI and all configuration is done by hand. The installer is a net-install system meaning that the ISOs to download are small and you only download the packages you need. The installer is text-based; fast, and the installed system is bare-bones with no default services running. Get it at http://annvix.org/ftp.php it`s a only 47.4 mb download

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Re: Re: Problem starting GNOME
by abhilash kumar 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

> I had added KPPP to startup and then I had removed > the same from the Start Menu| Preferences | More > Preferences| Sessions , Startup on my RHEL3. > Unfortunatly I don't have either .xinitrc or > .xinitrc.template for any of the users.... >If net access is available as another user then you are >fine. Just delete and recreate the account (but first >copy impt files if any). >_svaksh For normal user I did the same thing but what if the user were "root"??. There might be some configuration files where the startup information can be edited like in windows using "msconfig| startup items". I believe these files might have been corrupted. Abhilash Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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Re: Problem Starting GNOME
by abhilash kumar 31 Mar '05

31 Mar '05

>how was the application stopped & how did you remove >the entry, by using GUI or CLI ? >I am no expert but if you used GUI to delete the app, >afaik Linux is unlike the Windows OS where GUI is >used to 'uninstall' most applications. Here it is an >instance and you *may* have deleted the desktop >application for that particular user only. If CLI, >what command did you use ? Please give more details. >_svaksh_ >check out your .xinitrc.template file for >gnome= configuration. Do backup the original file before >you make any changes. >Sameer Hi I had added KPPP to startup and then I had removed the same from the Start Menu| Preferences | More Preferences| Sessions , Startup on my RHEL3. Unfortunatly I don't have either .xinitrc or .xinitrc.template for any of the users.... Regards Abhilash Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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using /bin/mail with smtp auth
by Ashok Iyer 30 Mar '05

30 Mar '05

I normally use the /bin/mail program to send mail from shell scripts. The smtp server is another machine on the network. On my host, I have done the required configuration in /etc/mail/submit.cf to point to the SMTP server. All this works without any problem. Is there any way I can use smtp authentication with the above setup? The smtp server now requries me to authenticate before sending mail. So the above method fails. Is there possible solution? Regards, Ashok

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RE:Re: Continuous receiving data on Broadband internet
by Nilesh Raykar 30 Mar '05

30 Mar '05

Dear Mr.Bhagat, Thanks. I got it. Used ehereal to find source of data which is mostly broadcast arp queries. I guess I may be paying Hathway for download of ~2 Mb/hr without actually downloading. Nilesh Raykar Get Your Private, Free E-mail from Indiatimes at http://email.indiatimes.com Buy The Best In BOOKS at http://www.bestsellers.indiatimes.com Bid for for Air Tickets @ Re.1 on Air Sahara Flights. Just log on to http://airsahara.indiatimes.com and Bid Now!

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South Asian LUG's contribution in OSS movmnt
by Vickram Crishna 30 Mar '05

30 Mar '05

fyi.... copied from another list This is Jhinuk from 'Linux For You' magazine, India. For our May issue, we are doing a story on the contribution of South Asian Linux User Group, in taking the Open Source movement ahead. As of now I have thought of the following categorisation for the story. In case the subject interests you, then kindly pass on all the infos to me w.r.t LUG activities in your respective areas before April 5. Also suggest me if I should add any other subhead into the story. Your opinion on the topic will be an added asset. -Localisation -Education -Trouble shooting -Recruitment -Reviews of Linux/OS software and distros -Information exchange. Regards Jhinuk Chowdhury Correspondent Linux For You Magazine D-87/1, Okhala Industrial Area Phase-1, New Delhi 110020 Ph: +91-11-26810602-3 (Ext-225) Mobile:+91-9899554189 lfyedit3(a)efyindia.com -- Vickram

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How to install Ck-erp package on linux
by neel s Gurjar 30 Mar '05

30 Mar '05

Hi How to install Ck-erp package onFC-3 ? Do anybody have Redhat Enterprise Edition 3 (RHEL-3) Please reply neel

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Quickcam driver problem in SuSe 9.2
by Sameer Niphadkar 30 Mar '05

30 Mar '05

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 Dinesh Joshi wrote : >> From: "Sameer Niphadkar" <spniphadkar(a)rediffmail.com> >>************************************************************************ >> Building modules, stage 2. >>make -rR -f /usr/src/linux-2.6.8-24/scripts/Makefile.modpost >> scripts/mod/modpost -m -i /usr/src/linux-2.6.8-24/Module.symvers -s /dev/null /home/galbotrix/qc-usb-messenger-0.8/quickcam.o >>/bin/sh: scripts/mod/modpost: No such file or directory >>make[2]: *** [__modpost] Error 127 >>make[1]: *** [modules] Error 2 >>make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/linux-2.6.8-24' >>make: *** [quickcam.ko] Error 2 >>ls: quickcam.ko: No such file or directory >>************************************************************************ >Yes sameer you're on top of the problem :). Try creating a symlink /usr/src/linux-2.6.xx to your kernel. Thanks Dinesh, I would try to create a sym link as you have mentioned but can you please explain about how to overwrite the present hard link. Because unless it is overwirtten the problem won't be solved. (This is as far as I know ) The hard link would have a higher priority over the softer one. Thanks once again Sameer 'You will be what you WILL to Be' -James Allen

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