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remounting a directory at a different place
by Philip S Tellis 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

someone had asked if it was possible to use the space from / in /usr i found this in man mount: Since Linux 2.4.0 it is possible to remount part of the file hierarchy somewhere else. The call is mount --bind olddir newdir maybe that can be used -- Treat end of file conditions in a uniform manner. - The Elements of Programming Style (Kernighan & Plaugher) Visit my webpage at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/ Read my writings at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/writings/ MSN philiptellis Yahoo! philiptellis

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Next Meet
by Nikhil Karkera 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

------------- Original Message -------------- "noel seq" <noelseq(a)hotmail.com> wrote: When and where is the next meet. Is it this sunday 8th ? ------------------ End ---------------------- Next meet is on 17 July at TIFR. It's after the RMS lecture I think. Meet announcements are put up on the LUG site: http://www.ilug-bom.org.in Regards, Nikhil. ____________________________________________________ Buy Feng Shui Package for Rs. 151/- only, at http://shopping.rediff.com/shopping/fengshui_mailer.htm

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Re: [[ILUG-BOM] Suggest Good Books for Linux Admin]
by ashok iyer 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

Look out for System Administrator's Guide and Network Admnistrator's Guide at www.ibiblio.org. Excellent reference material. There is another one that was available on the web somewhere called "Securing and Optimizing Red Hat Linux". I am not aware of the URL, probably google can help. Regards, Ashok

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Phone dialer, telephony
by Manish Jethani 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

I need a phone dialer for Linux. A program that can dial a number, play a sound file (a pre-recorded or on-the-fly generated message) and then disconnect. Manish -- Grabel's Law: 2 is not equal to 3 -- not even for large values of 2.

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Running fetchmail
by noel seq 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

I am using fetchmail in deamon mode every 5 mins to currently to download all mails. However the number of pop accounts have increased. Moreover some of the accounts receive mails more frequently while some receive only a few in a day. I want to run two deamons one every 5 mins and another every 15 mins. I am able to run two seperate scripts (other than .fetchmailrc) but when one time works in daemon mode the other cannot be executed. Please advise. Noel. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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[OT] A Solution to Linux/Unix Permissions
by Prakash Shetty aka Crux 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

Dear Linuxers, Heres a good patch for the Linux Kernel to improve on the Unix Permision System The url is http://trustees.sourceforge.net/ Heres a snippet from the site to let you all know what this is about <snip> The main goal of Linux trustees project is to create an advanced permission management system for linux. In fact, UNIX permission system is not suitable for solution of very common tasks. E.g., let a system administrator wants to create a directory that available for some groups in write mode, for another groups - in read only. The files in the directory and subdirectories should inherits the parent's behavior, unless other is stated explicitly. Using standard UNIX (and linux) security model it is generally speaking impossible to implement the situation when different groups have read/write and read/only permissions. This issue can be resolved by ext2-fs ACL project, but the problem is that nobody wants to copy mask or ACLs from parent directory to subdirectories either by hands or using special scripts. <snip/> Best Regards Prakash Shetty

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Need HardDisk Space for /usr
by Kompalli SuryaPrakash 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

Hi There, the O/P of df on my PC is as follows: - Filesystem 1k-blocks Used Available Use% Mounted on /dev/hda7 349989 162741 169179 50% / /dev/hda5 980308 896632 33880 97% /usr /dev/hda8 666480 414096 252384 63% /mnt/d-dos Is it possible for me to use some of the disk space of / to the /usr without affecting data on either one? BTW, If we need to add some extra space to any partition, without affecting the data, how do we do it? Thnx in advance... Bye, SP -- Please NOTE: - I have changed my Email ID to neosurya(a)yahoo.com from ksuryap1(a)yahoo.com _ _ |/ |_ |_| |\ompalli _|urya| rakash MSN : - neosurya(a)hotmail.com Email: - neosurya(a)yahoo.com Phone: - 022-5506101 _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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Next Meet
by noel seq 05 Jul '01

05 Jul '01

When and where is the next meet. Is it this sunday 8th ? Noel _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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Increase the file size limit
by Hotmail 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

Hi, I have a mysql database with me which is currently around 4GB in size. When I do a mysqldump for this database and redirect it to a file, I have problem with the file because of the limitation of the linux filesystem of 2GB is there any way I can increase the filesystem limit. Currently I am using gzip to compress the data and redirect it to the file. This however works but I do not want to compressed this file. TIA. Ciao, Volstan Stephen.

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Best tools for a database application?
by Nikhil Karkera 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

I need to choose a good combination of front & back ends for a database application. The application is quite simple. It is basically a muster, where employees can sign in by entering an employee-ID. For this I need to store a database of all employees with some basic fields like ID, name, etc. When someone enters an ID, a validity check is done and if valid the ID is stored into a table. My requirements: 1. Application will need to work on throw-away machines, like a 286 or 386. But the machine will be used solely for this application. 2. I need to use a language which is easy to learn (time constraint), given the fact that I only have knowledge of C and some C++. 3. Tomorrow I may need to add some more functionalities to the application. Basically running different queries for retrieving data. Also size of the employee database may increase. For starters I am looking at 100 to 1000 employees. For the database I guess mySQL would be ideal. (or is there a better option?) What should I use for the front end? And reasons for it. Many thanks, Nikhil. ____________________________________________________ Buy Feng Shui Package for Rs. 151/- only, at http://shopping.rediff.com/shopping/fengshui_mailer.htm

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Suggestion
by Fart Crimson 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

Hi, I had heard that you guys had an IRC server running on irc.ilug-bom.org.in. My li'll suggestion how about running Jabber server. Fart

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RH 7.2 & kernel 2.4.5 CDs required
by Mr. Sameer Shinde. 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

Hallo Linuxers, Can any body burn the CDs of RH 7.2 & kernel 2.4.5 or higher for me. as I can't affort to purches it form freeos.com Let me know how many blank CDs will be required for it. So that I can purches it & give for burning. I'm staying at Navi Mumbai. & will be pleased if any person close to this area do this for me as the contact will be fast in this case. With Thanks & Regards, SAMEER :) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit My website at: www.geocities.com/s9sameer My messanger IDs : MSN: s2sameer, Yahoo! : s9sameer Rediff Bol : s2sameer Aol : s2sameer

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] re : Mayuresh /c help
by Mayuresh A Kathe 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

> its Triptpal -- ( Tript = satisfaction in many languages ) :) Oops, sorry about that... Hmnn... Satisfaction, et all, eh... ;-) > Triptpal Singh > There is no chance, no fate, no destiny that can circumvent, or hinder, > or control a firm resolve of a determined soul. That's a great quote... ~Mayuresh -- The best way to predict the future, is to create it.

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RE: [ILUG-BOM] ulimit query
by Fart Crimson 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

hi u need to add the `ulimit' commands to the /etc/profile file to set system wide ulimit resources. u should also add the equivalent `limit' commands in /etc/csh.login for tcsh/csh users. Alternatively, explore PAM and /etc/security/limits.conf. Hope the info gets u started Fart

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sorry guys
by premstud＠vsnl.com 04 Jul '01

04 Jul '01

Sorry guys . Will take care in the future..

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Compressed files
by Sameer D. Sahasrabuddhe 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

Philip wrote: > > I think lossy compression applied to most of the web content (read > > junk, crap, "design") will make the world (wide web) a better place. > >Use lzip for this. It's the best tool around. Can get up to 100% >compression. LOL! For a minute there, I wasn't sure whether you had got the hang of the thread - it took a while to realise you were talking about lzip! :-) SameerDS. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] vpn setup
by nici bhatt 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

Hi if you look at this error it seems there r 2 errors one is of port and second is of dhcp could not assign ip address to client so what you need to do is 1> have you given any ip address pool or you are using DHCP server then look in to configuration of poptop and see where you have to mention ip address pool or dhcp. 2> by default when you enable vpn, ports are open by default if this is the case then your installation is not proper . this is only wild guess i am not sure because you have not given full info. if you need to open ports manuly then edit service file and key in ports number i am not sure about this. i will try to find this if i will get it i will mail you >From: premstud(a)vsnl.com >Reply-To: linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in >To: linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in >Subject: [ILUG-BOM] vpn setup >Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2001 07:28:17 +0530 (IST) > > >hello friends > >I am trying to setup a vpn on linux using poptop >http://poptop.lineo.com/download_pptp.html > >The server installed and started fine, but when i try >to connect a client to it, i get an error message saying that >there are no free ports or ip's to be given to the client >And it justs gives this error and doesnt accept client connections. > >any help would be appreciated. > >Thanking You, >Prem D'Souza. >_______________________________________________ >Richard Stallman's Public Lecture 5pm 17th July, at TIFR. >Linuxers mailing list >Linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in >http://mm.ilug-bom.org.in/mailman/listinfo/linuxers _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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Re: Re: [ILUG-BOM] Compressed files
by Nikhil Karkera 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

------------- Original Message -------------- Aseem <aseem(a)ports.cmc.net.in> wrote: On Fri, 29 Jun 2001, N. Shrikant wrote: > Are *.gz files really compressed into smaller sizes? try yourself. on linux note the file size before compression. and then then compress it with gzip, bzip2, winzip. and you will find that all these utilities do compress the files. compression you get depends on file format. i found that gzip compresses more for text files while bzip2 was good for binary file compression. i found both gzip and bzip2 better than winzip when it comes to maximum amount of compression. ---------------------- End --------------- Yep, you are right, compression results do depend on the file format. Compression basically reduces redundancies in data. Some file formats are already in compressed form. Like JPEG, MP3 etc. An MP3 file is just a compressed WAV file. So compressing these file formats won't give you very high compression ratio, since most of the redundancies have already been eliminated. Try saving a (fairly large) BMP as a JPEG file. Notice the reduction in size, which is a result of compression. If, interested in compression techniques, you'll find loads of reading material on the Net. If you know someone from the engineering fraternity, try getting hold of books like 'Computer Networks' by Tanenbaum, or 'Principles of Comm. Systems' by Taub & Schilling. Look for Information Theory in the latter. These are the books I came accross. There are many more. Regards, Nikhil. ____________________________________________________ Buy Feng Shui Package for Rs. 151/- only, at http://shopping.rediff.com/shopping/fengshui_mailer.htm

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re : Mayuresh /c help
by Triptpal Singh Lamba 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

Tritpal Paaji, Please do _NOT_ send ..........................etc etc its Triptpal -- ( Tript = satisfaction in many languages ) :) Thanks ..it was an oversight on my part .. i have set my outgoing mail to plain text . Regards, Triptpal Singh There is no chance, no fate, no destiny that can circumvent, or hinder, or control a firm resolve of a determined soul. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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re : cvs
by Triptpal Singh Lamba 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

reference : I have a stupid question to ask. What is this CVS thing ? answer : I hope i am right when i refer to cvs as this but this is what seems likely CVS is the Concurrent Versions System, the dominant open-source network-transparent version control system. CVS is useful for everyone from individual developers to large, distributed teams. Its client-server access method lets developers access the latest code from anywhere there's an Internet connection Its unreserved check-out model to version control avoids artificial conflicts common with the exclusive check-out model. Its client tools are available on most platforms anything else is available on http://cvshome.org/ Regards, Triptpal Singh There is no chance, no fate, no destiny that can circumvent, or hinder, or control a firm resolve of a determined soul. _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] The Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

>> >>just that I am really feeling sick about the whole issue of >> >>Simputer. >> > >> > Tell me more! >> >>Sameer, which area would you like to know more about? > > I want to know why you feel that way - I have only heard good things about > the Simputer for a long time, but you seem to have a different view OK... Well, to start with, I liked the efforts put in by the IISc guys, but what most people fail to understand is that it was done while keeping a commercial aspect in mind which is where Encore comes in picture. Now just considering the fact that they have targetted the Simputer at the Rural areas it seems to be a stupid to sell such an expensive device to them, where a more powerfull computing device can be sold at around the same costs. I am still unable to convince myself that a handheld would be more usefull to a person from the rural place than a proper trasport, communication infrastructure, power lines and water supply. So it comes around to the fact that those companies are basically trying to make money (or rather come out of their debts) by beating the drum in a sentimental "Made in India" band. Hope I am clear now... As a project Simputer might be good... But as a product, its pathetic. Warm Regards, ~Mayuresh

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vpn setup
by premstud＠vsnl.com 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

hello friends I am trying to setup a vpn on linux using poptop http://poptop.lineo.com/download_pptp.html The server installed and started fine, but when i try to connect a client to it, i get an error message saying that there are no free ports or ip's to be given to the client And it justs gives this error and doesnt accept client connections. any help would be appreciated. Thanking You, Prem D'Souza.

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Re : C help
by Mayuresh A Kathe 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

> Triptpal Singh > Before criticising anybody step into their shoes and walk for a mile. Tritpal Paaji, Please do _NOT_ send HTML mails, all of don't have a HTML capable email client Warm Regards, ~Mayuresh

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Re : C help
by Mayuresh A Kathe 03 Jul '01

03 Jul '01

> Triptpal Singh > Before criticising anybody step into their shoes and walk for a mile. Tritpal Paaji, Please do _NOT_ send HTML mails, all of don't have a HTML capable email client Warm Regards, ~Mayuresh

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Do we have a problem?
by Philip S Tellis 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

In today's Bombay Times, Vijay Mukhi states that he has never been anti linux, and that C++ is just a newer version of C. This is the same Vijay Mukhi who will be teaching our cops how to use Java, C# and TCP/IP, all in an attempt to get them to know more than the `hackers'. Philip -- What if everything is an illusion and nothing exists? In that case, I definitely overpaid for my carpet. -- Woody Allen, "Without Feathers" Visit my webpage at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/ Read my writings at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/writings/ MSN philiptellis Yahoo! philiptellis

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] The Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

> A more powerful device doesn't mean more power in their hands. > You could give them a p3 but that p3 will only have value as long > as they're actually getting something out of the power. I did see Now thats what I meant in my earlier mail (Arnold theory ;-) Unless they are using the tremendous power offered by the StrongARM, its a waste. > the simputer at IISc in Bangalore and from what I could see, this > has tremendous value as a information dissemination device. > Philip was right in saying that the primary use is likely to be > for output rather than input. This is definitely not a pathetic > product. Thats where you are wrong Mayank, the simputer is too sick as a information dissemination device, its best suited as a information gathering device. And as I said earlier, in the current state that they have positioned the Simputer, its not worth the hype. > You should check out this India today article > http://www.india-today.com/itoday/20010219/adapters.shtml. It > shows fisherman in kerala using GPS positining devices as well as > [snip] > Please don't make the mistake of assuming that since they're poor > and illiterate, they cannot ever learn to use a simple device > like the simputer. Mayank you are going at tangents... What made you think that I am assuming "since people are poor they cannot ever learn to use a simple device"? What I have mentioned is, the person will have to learn an extra script, and the device is certainly not worth that effort. But the Simputer certainly isn't simple enough nor is it sophisticated enough, it hangs somewhere in between with no identity what so ever. GPS positioning devices are one of the most sophisticated instruments I have come across and they are _verrrry_ expensive. > Relevant question here is whether there will be people who are > willing to manufacture the device and also provide the content > that is essential to the receiver of the content. I don't think a > farmer in North India would be interested in the prices of fish > down in kerala. The device is here as it the technology, but when > do we see it in the hands of the masses? People would be willing to manufacture it if they just want to hop on to the bandwagon, else they would want to manufacture it if the device makes some business sense. Regarding receiving content: Well don't you think it to be stupid not to include a wireless interface _inside_ a handheld portable device? But since they wanted to keep the costs low they had to put in a standard modem which hooks on to a phone line, now if the person wants to surf he has to be sitting near a phone jack, so what the heck, why not add a keyboard, mouse and an inexpensive monitor, and voila, you have an ultra low cost desktop. I don't see it in the hands of the masses in its current state, somehow I think the designers got their basic concepts wrong. ~Mayuresh

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Re : C help
by Triptpal Singh Lamba 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

wrt : I need to know If there is an online > (dowloadable or otherwise) verion of a good book on > C/C++ > like Dennis Ritchie / Bjarne Stroustroup... Ditto > for Unix. N/W prog. like Richard Stevens... I had > seen the 2nd Edition and felt it was mostly about > how different commands work answer goto : http://www.acm.org/crossroads/xrds3-2/ovp32.html U will find all u need Regards, Triptpal Singh Before criticising anybody step into their shoes and walk for a mile.

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Compressed files
by Nikhil Karkera 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

------------- Original Message -------------- Q u a s i <quasiabhi(a)yahoo.com> wrote: At 04:33 PM 6/29/01 +0000, Nikhil Karkera wrote: >An MP3 file is just a compressed WAV file. err. IMHO WAV -> MP3 is more than just plain compression. A lot of sophisticated techniques are used to decide which data is redundant and can be removed. The resultant compression is "lossy" - original data cannot be retrieved after decompression. Ditto for BMP -> JPEG. ---------------- End ------------------------ Yes, lossy compression techniques do throw away data. In case of images, JPEG exploits the limitations of the human eye, and throws away data in such a manner so as to try make the loss of data as unnoticable as possible. (image is represented in the form of a discrete signal I(x,y); pixel intensities represented by magnitude; signal magnitude is quantised to certain number of levels; no of quantisation levels variable; lesser quantisation levels = more compression & lesser quality; quantisation throws data). So also for MPEG compression. I guess it woldn't be right to call lossy compression a data compression technique (data = 0's and 1's), but rather an information compression technique(information = picture/sound represented by the 0's and 1's). But it is compression. Lossless compression on the other hand is a data compression technique. Regards, Nikhil. ____________________________________________________ Buy Feng Shui Package for Rs. 151/- only, at http://shopping.rediff.com/shopping/fengshui_mailer.htm

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CVS
by Rajen Parekh 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

Hi all, I have a stupid question to ask. What is this CVS thing ? I come across it at many places, mostly on download pages, but don't know anything about it. Could anyone enlighten me ? Regards, Rajen.

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[OFF TOPIC] Looking for Windows programming reference books
by S. Krishnan 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

Hi, I need the following Windows systems programming books urgently. If anyone is has them, I'd request either a short-term loan (say a week to 10 days), or alternatively, I'd be willing to buy them from anyone who wants to sell. 1. Systems Programming for Windows 95, by Walter Oney 2. Writing Windows VxDs & Device Drivers; Programming Secrets for Virtual Device Drivers, by Karen Hazzah Please e-mail me offlist if you can help me with these. TIA, Krishnan __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

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$MAIL: New mail notification in bash
by Manish Jethani 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

Bash has this feature of notifying you when you have new mail. The MAIL env. var. needs to be set to include the mail folders that need to be checked for new mail. On my system, I have included some of my Pine folders (e. g. $HOME/mail/linuxers) in $MAIL. I would like to know how bash "checks for new mail". Does it just use the "last accessed time"? I am sorry, I couldn't find any info on this in the manpage. My problem: After getting the notification ("You have new mail in linuxers") and reading the new message(s) using Pine, bash _again_ tells me that I have new mail. I suspect it just uses the last access time, which makes it so dumb in my case, because the message gets "marked as read/old" (thus modifying the mail folder file) since I have _just_read_it_. In short, it notifies me twice, once when I have new mail, and again when the mail has just been read. Any of you guys using this? How do you cope with it? Manish PS: I run fetchmail in daemon mode, so mail notification on the command line is cool for me. -- "If once a man indulges himself in murder, very soon he comes to think little of robbing; and from robbing he next comes to drinking and Sabbath-breaking, and from that to incivility and procrastination." -- Thomas De Quincey (1785 - 1859)

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Reminder: ACM Seminar on Data Compression, Friday June 29
by Durgesh D Rao 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

Dear Colleague, This is to remind you of the following ACM event. Once again, sorry for the delayed email. - Durgesh, for ACM Mumbai ACM Seminar Friday, June 29, 2001 - 6:30 p.m. Title: Data Compression Speaker: Sayyed S. A. A., NCST Venue: Lecture Theatre, NCST, Juhu Abstract:Data compression techniques are applied to files to reduce their size, which in turn increases the capacity of data storage and speeds up data transmission. Data compression draws heavily from information theory, which deals with the probability of some symbol appearing in the input. For totally random sources, each symbol is equally likely, but random sources are uncompressible. This means that the more probable an event, the less information it contains. Data compression techniques also work on this principle. If we look at real-world files, we find a lot of redundant data in them. Data compression exploits this redundancy to its advantage. I intend to give an overview of data compression About the Speaker: Mr Sayyed is a consultant in the Database and Knowledge Engineering division at NCST Juhu. His interests include Databases, compression and encryption. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Durgesh D Rao (DDR) | Email: durgesh(a)ncst.ernet.in Research Scientist, KBCS Division | Ph: 6201606x372(w), 7563437(r) National Centre for Software Technology | Fax: +91-22-6210139 Gulmohar Rd 9, Juhu, Mumbai 400049, INDIA.| Web: www.ncst.ernet.in/~durgesh ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Re-building the kernel
by Mayuresh A Kathe 02 Jul '01

02 Jul '01

Yup, this mail fixes it :-) ~Mayuresh > > Hi, > Sorry about the html.. hope this fixes it... > > As for the re-building the kernel.. i meant updating it with fixes of a > remote machine... a machine on which i dun have hands on access.. > > Philip answered my question.. > Thanx > Kunal > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mayuresh A Kathe" <mayuresh(a)vsnl.com> > To: <linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in> > Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2001 11:31 PM > Subject: Re: [ILUG-BOM] Re-building the kernel > > >> Hi Kunal, >> >> What do you exactly mean by re-building the kernel of a remote server? >> >> Awaiting your reply. >> >> ~Mayuresh >> >> PS: >> DO NOT send HTML mails, you are using Outlook Express, >> but most of us do not have an HTML aware email client. >> >> >> >> > >> > Hi, >> > I couldnt find anything on the ILUG site, on how to re-build the >> kernel of >> a > remote server... Could some one direct me to the right page? >> > Thanx, >> > Kunal >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Richard Stallman's Public Lecture 5pm 17th July, at TIFR. >> Linuxers mailing list >> Linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in >> http://mm.ilug-bom.org.in/mailman/listinfo/linuxers >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Richard Stallman's Public Lecture 5pm 17th July, at TIFR. > Linuxers mailing list > Linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in > http://mm.ilug-bom.org.in/mailman/listinfo/linuxers

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Re-building the kernel
by Mayuresh A Kathe 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

Hi Kunal, What do you exactly mean by re-building the kernel of a remote server? Awaiting your reply. ~Mayuresh PS: DO NOT send HTML mails, you are using Outlook Express, but most of us do not have an HTML aware email client. > > Hi, > I couldnt find anything on the ILUG site, on how to re-build the kernel of a > remote server... Could some one direct me to the right page? > Thanx, > Kunal

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Slackware
by Philip S Tellis 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

Slackware 8.0 is out. Has anyone written it to CD yet? Philip -- As Will Rogers would have said, "There is no such things as a free variable." Visit my webpage at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/ Read my writings at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/writings/ MSN philiptellis Yahoo! philiptellis

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Re-building the kernel
by Kunal Jhunjhunwala 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

Hi, I couldnt find anything on the ILUG site, on how to re-build the kernel of a remote server... Could some one direct me to the right page? Thanx, Kunal

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

> It would help if you could explain what you found lacking in their > X-implementation. And I don't understand what you mean by scalability in > the context of a Simputer. One of the biggest problems with the Simputer is it uses X. > | If you have to make > |a group of simputers work to help people you will have to rewrite hazzar stuff > Group of simputers working together to do what? I hope you understand that > Simputer is not for highend distributed computing. Just the fact that they are using X makes it straight away lean towards distributed computing. Do you know the power a StrongARM@206Mhz offers (remember its a RISC machine)? Its tremendous, putting it in a sickly handheld capable of doing the current things is like recruiting Arnold Schwarzenegger to pour you a glass of milk everyday. What Somesh probably meant by working together is networking... Devices so small should be able to network effortlessly with not just with their own kind, but also with desktop machines. > | I agree with mayuresh that > |a group of engineers can't make something worth the hype of simputer . > |In its present design simputer is useless piece of silicon. > > May be it is. May be it is not. But we should reason why it is or why it > is not. The reasoning will continue... ~Mayuresh

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

>> Encore developed the hardware and the IISc guys developed or rather >> put together the software, there are just a few instances where the >> IISc guys have litterally written the device drivers (I had > > IISc developed IML, the IML browser, text to speech converter for hindi > and kannada, integration of tts into IMLI, tapatap and some other user > space stuff. All system level stuff was taken from linux development > with minor changes. The IML browser (Imli) is actually "Chimera"... Actually I don't think they "developed" tapatap, but rather implemented one of the free handwritting recognition algorithms. I think most of the System level stuff (including the kernel) were taken from the StrongARM Linux port (I think that was the LART project) But they sure did a great job of implementing those technologies, better than re-inventing the wheel :-) ~Mayuresh

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NIC drops output
by Satish Dasi 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

Hi this is a newbie here I have 2 NICs both recognized by kudzu as RTL 8139 and RTLtoo. However after i changed the ip address on eth0 it started to behave strangely. Both the cards didnt ping their own ips neither the ips of the network machines to which they were connected. Is there a prob with the cards or with Linux generic divers????? Pls help me out in this Thanx in advance Satish

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] The Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

> The main thing is that IISc will not be building the simputer. Only its > specification. The specification is released openly under the SGPL, and > anyone can build an implementation. The software is downloadable under > the GPL. Got that... But, what I am trying to point out (unsuccessfully) is that, I admire the things done at IISc (had interacted with one of the guys) but based on the things done at IISc (including the true goal of reaching the masses) companies like Encore are taking a free ride on getting the government to subsidize certain operations of theirs, that is really sick, beacuse for them its primarily business. Any ways, just for a bit of info about Encore, they have a whole lot of old 486 laptops lying with them which they are ready to sell off at dirt cheap rates (remember my earlier post regarding the same?), that just goes to prove the condition of the company... Well, its their job, let them do it as per what they think is right. > Anyway, I thought the project was good, and you didn't. Lets leave it > at that. Yup, sorry if I gave an impression that I want to prove you wrong or that I am right, just that I am really feeling sick about the whole issue of Simputer. Warm Regards, ~Mayuresh

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Remote Installation
by Kompalli SuryaPrakash 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

> Hi Linux Champs, > Is there any [simply ANY] way to install Linux REMOTELY. > I know this question is stupid, but any REMOTE possibilities, > ideas, thaughts, etc are really appreciated. U mean?? Like one doesnt have direct access to the keyboard / mouse of the machine on which u are going to install Linux? I dont remember any distro which can do that right now, But If u mean accessing the media containing the installation files remotely, with u sitting in front of the machine u want to install linux on, then this can be done using NFS,ftp or HTTP install.... u need to use the bootnet.img available on any any installation disk and boot off a floppy. Then follow instructions... Bye, SP -- _ _ |/ |_ |_| |\ompalli _|urya| rakash MSN : - ksuryap(a)hotmail.com Email: - ksuryap1(a)yahoo.com Phone: - 022-5506101 _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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simputer
by Philip S Tellis 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

Ok, I think before anyone posts anything more about the simputer, you should first read *everything* on their website. There's no point arguing here about stuff that's already in the faq. Like I say always, read the docs, and don't ask questions that are already answered there. That's what the docs are meant for. Philip -- Make the coupling between modules visible. - The Elements of Programming Style (Kernighan & Plaugher) Visit my webpage at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/ Read my writings at http://www.ncst.ernet.in/~philip/writings/ MSN philiptellis Yahoo! philiptellis

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

> The product is an Open Source hardware project, which has naturally used the > Open Source approach to its software development as well. The IISc has > undertaken the devlopment, with the active cooperation of many others. Now > that it has reached the kickoff stage, it is possible to reach out and > commercialise the production. So Encore (as I understand from the mails, I > do not recall seeing any announcment to that effect, but then I haven't > surfed thru the site either for a couple of fortnights) is one of the > companies that has decided to do this. Encore has not one of the companies that has decided to do this after the project is over, rather Encore has had vested interests since begining and has been investing on the hardware heavily. So simply put, the situation is like: Encore developed the hardware and the IISc guys developed or rather put together the software, there are just a few instances where the IISc guys have litterally written the device drivers (I had interacted with one of them, a guy called Pai, don't remember is first name though) > If the ex-factory cost is 3k and the retail price is 6k, does anyone think > this is wrong? Vickram, the ex-factory costs can't be 3K, just the base component costs are 3K. As in my earlier mail, add the rest of the stuff and voila, you have a "White Elephant". ~Mayuresh

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Simputer
by Vickram Crishna 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

I have been browsing thru the debate on Simputer, and am curious about some of the directions this has taken. The product is an Open Source hardware project, which has naturally used the Open Source approach to its software development as well. The IISc has undertaken the devlopment, with the active cooperation of many others. Now that it has reached the kickoff stage, it is possible to reach out and commercialise the production. So Encore (as I understand from the mails, I do not recall seeing any announcment to that effect, but then I haven't surfed thru the site either for a couple of fortnights) is one of the companies that has decided to do this. If the ex-factory cost is 3k and the retail price is 6k, does anyone think this is wrong? I very much doubt that the company will make any money at all on this for many years to come. Unless of course, it takes off like a rocket (a la i-mode in Japan) in which case I am sure that others will jump on the bandwagon and the price will fall. Till then the 3k gross margin per piece will flow out like water, absorbed by thirsty distribution, marketing and overhead costs. Why am I so interested? As some of you will know from my earlier mail, I have initiated the Hawking Communicator project in Open Source (www.radiophony.com/hawking.html) and at some point this project too will move towards commercialisation. I am keen to discuss all aspects of this with as many groups of people as possible, so that we as developers are properly prepared to do whatever it takes to get the software used. This is not the forum for such a discussion, so please do join in the development discussion at Yahoo!groups (/radiophony) or mail me directly. Vickram Crishna

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RE: Remote Linux Installation [WAS: Simputer]
by Kunal Walia 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

Try GHOST ! >===== Original Message From linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in ===== >Hi Linux Champs, >Is there any [simply ANY] way to install Linux REMOTELY. >I know this question is stupid, but any REMOTE possibilities, >ideas, thaughts, etc are really appreciated. >Thx, >Sandeep > > > >_______________________________________________ >Richard Stallman's Public Lecture 5pm 17th July, at TIFR. >Linuxers mailing list >Linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in >http://mm.ilug-bom.org.in/mailman/listinfo/linuxers - Kunal ******************************************************* Your work needn't be lost if you ever built castles in the air, now just build foundations beneath them. *******************************************************

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] The Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 01 Jul '01

01 Jul '01

>>just that I am really feeling sick about the whole issue of >>Simputer. > > Tell me more! Sameer, which area would you like to know more about? ~Mayuresh

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] The Simputer
by Mayuresh A Kathe 30 Jun '01

30 Jun '01

>>Now tell me Philip, if you have used a handheld computer, is it >>easier/faster to type or scribble? >>Mind you, scribbling is not the same as writing. >>And the hand writing recoqnition technology can never be perfected, > > Did you read about the stuff called "tapatap" that they describe on their > website? From what I gather, they have devised a very rudimentary input > mechanism for very simple interaction when requird. Keep in mind that the > device is intended for _illiterate_ villagers, and nobody expects them to > enter any data in it. That is mentioned explicitly in the wired.com article. Now now Sameer, there you go again... Have you ever worked on a handheld? I too probably wouldn't have except for a rich friend of mine. What do you think would it mean by a rudimentary input system? Do you think just by placing a few taps you can access any data? For accessing data, you need to place queries, and queries need explicit search parameters, how do you suppose that can be achieved? >>the best of technology companies like Apple, Palm and a few Russian >>(who pioneered it) companies have tried and failed miserably. > So WHAT? Even the GNU people were unable to create a kernel for their > system until a University student from Finland came along ... Again, Sameer, have you ever thought about how handwritting recognition works? Have you thought or tried to code a handwriting recognition interface? Do you know how difficult it is? Or rather do you know a simple character like "A" can be written in more styles than one by multiple people with different personality types? That "A" is just from the Roman script, have you thought the complexity of deciphering any of the Indian scripts (I would consider Devnagari to be the simplest). >>Have you figured out the BOM of the Simputer? > I have to confess absolute ignorance in this regard! Thats OK... >>Once you are through with the above, tell me if its possible to create >>a "Simputer" (as the creators have envisaged) > People from the original Simputer team at IISc have established a > commercial venture just to do that - called Picopeta something ... Hmnn... >>One of the best projects in India?? > > Reminds me of the fact that India was the first country in the world to use > satellite communication for mass rural education, that too when India > didn't even have a single communcitation satellite of her own ... > > I think that what the IISc people are trying to do is to turn the concept > of a "computer" on its head. They are trying to use technology to help > people in a way comfortable to them - this is a place where we have to keep > back all our presumptions about human-computer interaction based on the PC. > Think of it as an interactive TV set if you want, designed to disperse > informatin rather than handle complex computing tasks. Now what do _you_ think is the concept of a "computer"? As you mentioned that "They are trying to use technology to help people in a way comfortable to them", that is exactly what _Human Computer Interaction_ is all about... So we cannot keep back all our presumptions about Human Computer Interaction... > I had always hoped to get close to the Simputer project if I had been able > to get into the IISc for my post-graduation; but I guess that won't be > happening now! If you hoped to get to IISc, well thats good, thats a neat place with lot of facilities... But if you hoped to get close to the Simputer project, forget it, its not worth it... Just a bunch of techies don't make great computing devices, for that you need to have experts on HCI and somebody with a clear vision about what is to be done. Warm Regards, ~Mayuresh

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Zen, network topology, and Linux.
by Satya 30 Jun '01

30 Jun '01

Hypothetically... I have a DSL connection to the World. A hub is plugged into it, and 2-6 computers into the hub. Naturally, the computers have a class C (?) between them, which should not be routable from the World. The computers have their own connection to the World through the hub and DSL. I think the whole thing is a star topology, at least for the internal network. Is what I have described above correct, and possible? I suppose ideally, one of the Linux boxen would get the DSL line and act as firewall to the rest through the hub? Now... whichever way, how do I do it on Linux? ipchains alone is enough? -- Satya. <URL:http://satya.virtualave.net/> US-bound grad students! For pre-apps, see <URL:http://quickapps.cjb.net/> Within five minutes, ReRob learned that walking through the basement of Fuller Labs wearing futuristic body armor and pushing a variable-geometry motorcycle raises eyebrows. Telling students that this is the true power of UNIX didn't help. -- Undocumented Features I.

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ulimit query
by Kanti Jadia 30 Jun '01

30 Jun '01

Sir, I need to set the ulimit parameter for all the users so that it is fairly large(Linux kernel 2.2.14). The problem is if i do the same for root than it is done easily,but when it comes to user x,it is giving me Operation not permitted.Can i set it globally for all users. Hoping for the best Kanti Jadia __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

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TUMTUM - Technology Unto Masses
by G Waraich 30 Jun '01

30 Jun '01

In an attempt to garner political support for Linux, Jansangh, the parent organization of BJP is the first to embrace and promote Linux for bringing technology right down to the grass root levels. A temporary website for TUMTUM, which would act as a vehicle for bringing technical awareness to masses has been setup at http://tumtumonline.tripod.com The first awareness campaign, however is titled "How to Trace a Lost Mobile Phone" and it discusses the following issues 1)Country-wide, state-wise and metro-wise statistical data on the total mobile phone subscribers in India till April 2001. 2)the role of ESN/IMEI numbers and EIR/HLR registers in tracing lost or stolen cellular phones. 3)radio triangulation techniques, fore-runner of MPS, mobile positioning systems, for locating the position of a mobile vector for providing location based services. Early in July, a national convention of Akhil Bharatiya Jansangh is scheduled to be held in mumbai, where along with other things on their agenda, following two things shall be taken up 1) A formal incorporation of the technology division 2) A "bhashan" on why Linux is the only choice to bring technology to the masses and bridge the digital divide. Date, time, venue of the convention would be communicated to ILUG Mumbai Junta, as soon as available. Please be generous with your comments, suggestion, criticism about this development. Have fun, Vande Mataram. -- Get your free email from www.linuxmail.org Powered by Outblaze

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