On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 5:26 PM, pavithran s <pavi.eu(a)gmail.com> wrote: 8. Mukti ( conducted by NIT-Durgapur) www.mkti.in -- Regards, Vignesh B. Tech in Computer Science National Institute Of Technology-Durgapur

On Wednesday 02 June 2010 17:57:17 shreekant bohra wrote: this year? -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Wednesday 02 June 2010 19:22:22 Kartik Mistry wrote: happened -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

not really: happens = simple present tense, referring to something that is 'either a habit' or 'happens regularly'. I think it would be reasonable to conclude that since FOSS.in has 'happened' toward the end of the year for the past 9 years, that it 'happens' during November / December. Maybe a statement that does not make any assumptions about the future would read something like "foss.in has happened at the end of year for the past 9 years.". Am not sure if you violate the spirit of The Zen of Python (in the face of ambiguity, refuse the temptation to guess) by saying 'happens', but I certainly don't think it would be against english grammatical rules to say something 'happens' if it is an observed predictable pattern of behaviour over a period of time, in this case, foss.in 'happening' at the end of the year. Sorry for that - awakened the grammar nazi in me. All the best, Sanjay

ok, apologies to all and really, nothing serious intended :) ill stick to grammar, since the intent of my post was to clarify the grammar and perhaps logic of the statement 'foss.in happens at the end of the year', and not the history, physics or astrology of the same. I will stand corrected - was perhaps confused by their website which has event schedules that go back to 2001. My point still stands. It is an event with noticed periodicity, hence it 'happens'. I guess this can be a matter of debate, but the simple present tense is not a statement of certainty about the future - something like "he goes to school at 9 in the morning" again is a bit different from "he will go to school at 9 tomorrow morning". The first is based on observed habitual behaviour, in that he goes to school, without a definitive statement about the future, which, imo, is valid. It would be a bit ridiculous to say, "he has gone to school at 9 in the morning for the past 9 years and so will probably go to school at 9 tomorrow morning" instead of "he goes to school at 9 in the morning". It is not a scientific certainty that he will go to school at 9 in the morning, of course, but simple present tense is not making a definitive statement about the future - it is simply saying something 'happens' based on observed periodicity. Saying foss.in 'happens at the end of the year' isn't a predictive statement - saying 'foss.in will happen at the end of this year' is. The first is just a statement based on observed periodicity. It has nothing to do with astrology or physics or chemistry. We can argue on what would qualify something as being observed periodical behaviour, but the way I see it an event running for 5 (9?) years makes it qualify as observed periodical behaviour. This is in no way a definitive statement about the continuation of this observed periodical behaviour. sure, I apologize for my error. I think the grammatical point I was making still stands. I wouldn't disagree with you necessarily on the logic part of it, nor on the astrology or physics or chemistry part of it. I still stick to my point about the correctness of grammar though - if something is observed behaviour for a period of time, it is perfectly reasonable to say something 'happens'. It doesn't have to be a certain prediction of the future, or correct in terms of astrology, physics, chemistry, etc. for it to be a grammatically and semantically correct statement. if we team up, we could be the greatest force since the third reich? ok, apologies to everyone for taking this OT . shall try and refrain from any more of this :) cheers, Sanjay

On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 6:55 PM, Kartik Mistry &lt;kartik.mistry(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: And, what does that indicate ? -- sankarshan mukhopadhyay <http://sankarshan.randomink.org/blog/>

On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:35 PM, Kartik Mistry &lt;kartik.mistry(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: Why would you want to limit the outcome viz. participation in FOSS to students of SICSR only ? -- sankarshan mukhopadhyay <http://sankarshan.randomink.org/blog/>

On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:44 PM, Kartik Mistry &lt;kartik.mistry(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: That still doesn't directly answer the question as to why you think that since SICSR students only 'organize' and not 'contribute' GNUnify is an event not worth considering of too much importance. I'd like to understand why you measure it with only SICSR participation/contribution. -- sankarshan mukhopadhyay <http://sankarshan.randomink.org/blog/>

FOSS events are great way to meet new and exciting people, celebrate FOSS and learn a few things as well and it hardly matters that where and who organizes it. Its a plus point though, if the people who organize FOSS events are actually FOSS developers or enthusiasts . On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:35 PM, Kartik Mistry &lt;kartik.mistry(a)gmail.com&gt;wrote;wrote: -- Shree Kant Bohra Let the Source be open www.geekybuddha.org GPG Key Fingerprint - D2E1 A688 FC61 C3F5 DFE5 F972 4E7F 1243 6E23 5F22

On Thu, Jun 03, 2010 at 06:48:31PM +0530, shreekant bohra wrote: I agree. As long as it spreads the word, it is a success. Someday, one of those students might embrace the FOSS philosophy. It is important to keep the wheel rolling. And after all an even is an event. No one should judge it as good or bad to get it listed on the FOSS India Calender. As far as I understand, most of the times the participation in the event is contingent upon the venue and time of the event - so more the events that get listed, better are the chances that more people will get involved. So far as to say that even a install-fest in the local community should get listed for maximum visibility. Also its not just enough to create and publicise the list of events being organised. The site can also contain a section which syndicates the blog entries pertaining to such events so that other people can gain the ideas regarding how to organise events. It will also spread the notion that such ideas are organised successfully. -- Regards, Nitesh Mistry www.mistrynitesh.com -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.12 GB/J/IT/O>TW d+(-) s+:+>: a- C+ UL>+++ P L++>+++ !E W++ N* o? K? w--- O? M-- V? PS+() PE(++)(-) Y+ PGP+ t 5? X R tv+ b+ DI D G e+++>++++ h-- !r y? ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------

On Thursday 03 June 2010 21:02:27 Rony wrote: the whole idea of FOSS events is that we can meet each other and put faces to names - which brings me to the big question: why are you always missing when I come to Mumbai? -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Thursday 03 June 2010 22:50:45 Rony wrote: thank god you believe in astrology - with all these young farts populating the Mumbai list, I am fast losing hope! -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Thursday 03 June 2010 21:02:27 Rony wrote: Why is multimedia a problem? -- Rgds JTD

On Friday 04 June 2010 16:22:58 Sanket Shah wrote: Multimedia as in professional Multimedia was always miles ahead of doze. Listen to a puretone on linux and listen to the same on doze. Oh well maybe one's ears are a bitwornout. Use a distortion meter and you will know. Playing mp3s on tinpot speakers is not mutimedia. It's time pass. Nonetheless i havent had a problem with tinpot multimedia since 2002. Ah the drafting package masqerading as cad. IMO R & D requires stuff that industrial guys dont even know about. So that would put the R&D stuff 5 years ahead of the industry. -- Rgds JTD

On 5 June 2010 22:41, Rony &lt;gnulinuxist(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: I am surprised you haven't heard of blender and its usage in the industry ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blender_%28software%29#Use_in_the_media_indust… If you are looking for something in 2D industry especially an alternative to flash I am afraid none exists in free software which comes near it . Flash has its accessibility issues and is now kicked by apple ( for its own reasons ) . The market which is going towards mobile devices will almost be void of flash with 2 major players being google android and iphone moving towards HTML 5 . Even the big daddy M$ which is tending towards its own proprietary solution(silver or moon light) announced that it will support HTML5 . Its CSS3 and JS which will rule the web/mobile web which IMHO is where the multimedia market is . Or if you are talking of plain audio/video editing . There are tools but we need to search better ! Cinelerra is good for video editing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinelerra while I would definitely recommend audacity for audio http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audacity Regards, Pavithran Regards, Pavithran

On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:35 PM, Kartik Mistry &lt;kartik.mistry(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: The main motive of Gnunify as per event slogan is 'A Forum to Unite open minds', and thats what it aims to do, promise is not to get XYZ lines of code written by the students or the attendees, but leaving the forum open to such ideas. As for the students themselves though they may not be direct contributors to some FOSS project, but the organization process has opened quite a few to FOSS and making careers in it. Maybe the structure of event seems repetitive (yes there still is an install fest!), but its always been open for discussion and change. and not to mention the vertical layout of rooms which does keep many a lazy folk away who want to avoid climbing up and down a dozen times a day. Karunakar

On Thursday 03 June 2010 21:19:44 pavithran s wrote: IIIT offered the venue free of cost with all facilities, but the careless arrogant attitude of the organisers torpedoed the event. When are we going to learn to be professional? Do you really expect college professors to respect people who turn up unshaven, with tee-shirts with a know_it_all air? I have seen these same guys in foreign with tie and coat, with serious preparation and well thought out talks - fully prepared and documented. They even turn up in time! I remember one of ilug mumbai heroes giving a talk on Octave as a replacement for matlab. The guy knew nothing about octave or about matlab, and his audience was a bunch of vice-chancellors and HOD's. He was so arrogant that he thought that since he was a FOSS poster boy they would listen to him without question. Anyway he tried to show them how to do 2+2=4 with octave. Could not do it. Worse, he could not even make the projector work properly with his laptop. I had told him to make sure it was working - but he preferred to spend that time having lunch! Half the audience walked off - finally one of the 'old farts' gave him a slip of paper to show him how to do it. It turns out that the said 'old fart' was a Pune university professor who had been using octave for the past several years and had even written a book on it! lesson: respect the 'old farts' -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Saturday 05 June 2010 13:12:40 pavithran s wrote: I have many bitter experiences with the organisers of mukt.in - and I stand by my statement that is what I am saying - some of you 'tend to be informal' which older people do not like. That is the attitude I am criticising - these same people can be seen in coat and tie when going for visa interview at foreign consulates - why not be informal there? FOSS is a serious professional venture and unless we behave like serious professionals, we will get no where. in India, if you do not know how to deal tactfully with profs, and older people, you will get no where. -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Saturday 05 June 2010 21:32:57 Sameep wrote: google is not an Indian University -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Sunday 06 June 2010 09:28:30 Saswata Banerjee & Associates wrote: Also I might add there is a vast difference between being informal and unkempt. -- Rgds JTD

On Sun, Jun 6, 2010 at 2:47 PM, Sameep &lt;sameep(a)tuxwire.com&gt; wrote: Wrong example. Do you have an example of an interview for a position in Marketing/Sales? An event organizer is effectively that. Have you seen Steve Jobs shabbily dressed? As someone mentioned earlier, there is a difference between casual and unkempt. Also, Jobs is not just another guy in the office. He does not need to impress anyone or make any impact. When he needed to do that (early in his career), he would dress sharp so that people actually take him seriously. -- Siddhesh Poyarekar http://siddhesh.in

On 06-Jun-2010, at 7:14 PM, Siddhesh Poyarekar wrote: I did read the end . The comments are quite interesting too.

On Sun, Jun 6, 2010 at 7:42 PM, Sameep &lt;sameep(a)tuxwire.com&gt; wrote: Yes, I did realize that and hence my second email. He does not... really. He did when he had to, when he had to get his startup off the ground. Now he is the benevolent dictator of a company and effectively an entire industry. He walks around in a pink thong and there will be enough people tweeting about how great that new fashion is. -- Siddhesh Poyarekar http://siddhesh.in

On Sunday 06 June 2010 14:47:31 Sameep wrote: who is steve jobs? does he need to apply for a job - or for facilities for holding a foss conference in a university? -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

Greetings, On 6/6/10, Kenneth Gonsalves &lt;lawgon(a)au-kbc.org&gt; wrote: ... who churn out a lot of unemployable junk who proliferate every service field giving hell to their customers most of the time -- execpt for FLOSS sector. Regards Rajagopal

On Sunday 06 June 2010 14:40:54 Sameep wrote: then why do my friends wear suits to go to the consulate but go unshaven to the university? -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Monday 07 June 2010 17:57:34 Sameep wrote: either you have not followed the thread, or you are just posting for the sake of posting. -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Monday 07 June 2010 18:24:05 Sameep wrote: the thread is this: one of the problems with holding foss events is the difficulty of getting space to hold them. One alternative is to hire halls - which cost in lakhs for sufficient space. The other alternative is to get it hosted by some college or university - this has usually been a huge success. The downside to this is that one has to deal with academics. In most places there is not much of a problem as long as the people on our side are polite, show respect and are reasonably well dressed. Unfortunately some of our people do not show such 'respect'. So the staff in the University tend to ignore them - the thinking is: 'I am a HOD with years of experience and a Phd. Who is this guy with just a basic degree to treat me as an equal?' The result is an ego clash, and the whole engagement goes sour. However the same 'casual informal' people, when it is their turn to impress people - for a job interview, to get clients or to get a visa - they turn up impeccably dressed. It has already been pointed out in this thread, that Google employees are not out to impress people outside their establishment and also that the atmosphere they work in is totally different from the atmosphere and culture in Indian Universities. No doubt if you turn up in a Tee shirt and jeans and ask google for space to hold a conference, they will not hold your dress style or manners against you. But we are not talking of google - we are talking of the many times negotiations with universities have broken down because of this factor. btw, most of the academics expect to be addressed as 'Sir' or 'Professor' and if you do not do so - you will not get very far. I hope this explanation is sufficient for you - if you require any further clarifications please do not hesitate to ask. btw, I have 10 years experience in this particular field, and unlikely as it may sound, I know what I am talking about. -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On Monday 07 June 2010 18:50:38 sankarshan wrote: he has probably retired in total confusion! -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

On 5 June 2010 13:41, Kenneth Gonsalves &lt;lawgon(a)au-kbc.org&gt; wrote: +1 I agree completely and I think 'being tactical' was lacking at that time ! BTW Have you seen the movie three idiots ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3_Idiots Regards, Pavithran

On Monday 07 June 2010 10:27:31 Shakthi Kannan wrote: I have had many interactions with these people - and their workstyle has always made me extremely frustrated - no replies to emails, not keeping appointments etc. The only thing that works is phone calls and visits. But unfortunately this is more or less the norm in many institutions. There are many places where they go out of their way to be helpful - but these are usually an exception. Where the lower level staff are not cooperative, there is no other way than repeatedly going to the top. Which I finally did in your case, but by then matters had gone beyond repair - although the staff concerned did apologize and offered to help, it was too late. Unfortunately in these cases one needs extreme patience - I have even faced these problems in MIT and Anna University. I do not know if you will remember, but when Fossconf was held in MIT, the dean and other professors were busy taking classes in the halls that were allotted to the conference and there was huge confusion and many talks started late. This was in spite of the fact that we had several meetings with him and the vice chancellor regarding the timings. perhaps some day when I have time I will chronicle the 'fun' we had with VJTI over a period of a year or so. I am sure Anurag and Mehul are still having nightmares about that! But we did accomplish something - but no where near what we could have ... -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC