On Saturday 06 Dec 2008 11:38:05 pm Mikel Maron wrote:
unfortunately the OSM data for this area is still b0rked
What can we do? There's been some editing in Coloba recently, adding places involved in the attack. With the attention right now, we certainly harvest some work and could get Coloba sorted out in short order. The Yahoo imagery could help as a first pass. Seem like a good idea? Any thoughts on how to proceed?
people who know Mumbai have to do it - we have verified that the satellite data is accurate and had a sprint where a few major roads were done. I did some stuff in the Versova area and in worli too. We just have to wait until people in Mumbai start work. New areas, apart from Chennai, Ludhiana, Delhi and Ooty where good work is going on are Coimbatore and Hyderabad.
Kenneth Gonsalves wrote:
On Saturday 06 Dec 2008 11:38:05 pm Mikel Maron wrote:
unfortunately the OSM data for this area is still b0rked
What can we do? There's been some editing in Coloba recently, adding places involved in the attack. With the attention right now, we certainly harvest some work and could get Coloba sorted out in short order. The Yahoo imagery could help as a first pass. Seem like a good idea? Any thoughts on how to proceed?
people who know Mumbai have to do it - we have verified that the satellite data is accurate and had a sprint where a few major roads were done. I did some stuff in the Versova area and in worli too. We just have to wait until people in Mumbai start work. New areas, apart from Chennai, Ludhiana, Delhi and Ooty where good work is going on are Coimbatore and Hyderabad
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions and reduced the requirement of having to stay in Mumbai and do a proper reconnaissance. At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Regards Saswata
On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Saswata Banerjee scrapo@saswatabanerjee.com wrote:
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions
<snip>
At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Are digital map form MapMyIndia, Yahoo, Google and like that, are security threat to Nations? Even if maps are not there, satellite images having same detail are available publicly. Developed countries are having more detail and developing or under-developed countries.
Is there mis-match between the use of high-tech by security agencies and public (including anti-social element)?
H.S.Rai wrote:
On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Saswata Banerjee scrapo@saswatabanerjee.com wrote:
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions
<snip>
At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Are digital map form MapMyIndia, Yahoo, Google and like that, are security threat to Nations? Even if maps are not there, satellite images having same detail are available publicly. Developed countries are having more detail and developing or under-developed countries.
Is there mis-match between the use of high-tech by security agencies and public (including anti-social element)?
Sattelite maps are of lesser use than the digital maps like OSM or Yahoo Maps as they do not have details of places, roads, buildings and their usage.
Considering that we have very little security, intelligence services and poor leadership, the less help we give to the "anti social elements" the better. At the moment, OSM is absolutely off the mark. I do not think even 5% of the map is correct. God help anyone trying to use it. With correct maps.......
Regards saswata
Hi all, If you guys are debating of and for satellite maps then this wikipedia entry should interest you all. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satellite_imagery
Specificially this part
"GSD for Intelligence/Military purposes (see NRO) may have a resolution of less than a centimeter with the potential for real-time (live) imaging."
and
"Commercial satellite companies do not place their imagery into the public domain and do not sell their imagery; instead, one must be licensed to use their imagery."
A simple google search would throw what kind of commercial imagery and maps are available.
A parallel to be drawn would be http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0209/resources_geo.html and http://www.planetizen.com/node/5107
This simply tells that better mapping should help in understanding how and what happened and could also perhaps help detect patterns not known other ways.
Of course, this means the workers (or supervisors I guess) would need to be able to read, analyze and infer stuff from maps.
From what little I know, we are not a map-friendly culture.
On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Saswata Banerjee < scrapo@saswatabanerjee.com> wrote:
Kenneth Gonsalves wrote:
On Saturday 06 Dec 2008 11:38:05 pm Mikel Maron wrote:
unfortunately the OSM data for this area is still b0rked
What can we do? There's been some editing in Coloba recently, adding
places
involved in the attack. With the attention right now, we certainly
harvest
some work and could get Coloba sorted out in short order. The Yahoo
imagery
people who know Mumbai have to do it - we have verified that the
satellite
data is accurate and had a sprint where a few major roads were done. I
did
some stuff in the Versova area and in worli too. We just have to wait
until
people in Mumbai start work. New areas, apart from Chennai, Ludhiana,
Delhi
and Ooty where good work is going on are Coimbatore and Hyderabad
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions and reduced the requirement of having to stay in Mumbai and do a proper reconnaissance. At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Regards Saswata -- http://mm.glug-bom.org/mailman/listinfo/linuxers
On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
Kenneth Gonsalves wrote:
people who know Mumbai have to do it - we have verified that the
satellite
data is accurate and had a sprint where a few major roads were done. I
did
some stuff in the Versova area and in worli too. We just have to wait
until
people in Mumbai start work. New areas, apart from Chennai, Ludhiana,
Delhi
and Ooty where good work is going on are Coimbatore and Hyderabad
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions and reduced the requirement of having to stay in Mumbai and do a proper reconnaissance. At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Right now anyone doing it on the streets of Mumbai is most likely to end up in an isolated high security cell wearing only undergarments.
On Sun, Dec 7, 2008 at 7:41 PM, Rony Bill gnulinuxist@gmail.com wrote:
Right now anyone doing it on the streets of Mumbai is most likely to end up in an isolated high security cell wearing only undergarments.
This is what we should guard against and fight for.
-- Regards,
Rony.
With regards,
On Sunday 07 December 2008 11:03, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions and reduced the requirement of having to stay in Mumbai and do a proper reconnaissance. At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Terrorists are not isolated 4th standard pass idiots as made out to be by our dimwit sec personnel. They have access to far more resources than most police personnel even in well developed countries. And we all know the Pak army dont have digital maps - they just ask around before shooting of missiles. God i shudder to think about the type of idiots who run this country. AND they are abetted in large measures by corrupt locals - some eking out an existence, some out of greed. In this case the coast guard, customs and excise, police and fisher folk. How do you think that Manish market and HeraPanna gets it's imported goodies. Infact entire container loads of contrabrand pass thru the docks every night. The authorities are fully aware of these loopholes and are just trying to hoodwink the public. Attacks use existing loopholes available in abundance. No amount of guns n gizmos, draconian laws and ban the google will help the woefully corrupt cops. It starts with recruitment and carries on from there. Helped along the way by not being paid salaries for months, political interference, horrendous working conditions etc etc. For all the shouting from the rooftops about Paki support, the Indian government has no evidence from this or any of the past attacks that will withstand scrutiny in a court of law. If it did, it could easily take it's case to the Hague and screw the shit out of pakistan and it's chuppa rustom friend USA without firing a bullet. Did i say USA? USA is our friend too. Nothing like sorting out terrorists attacks over whiskey n soda amongst friends. Our new friends will be happy to sell us the latest terrorist seeking gizmo for a few billion and then redistribute a little of that billion to other "friends" in great need to fight the war on terror.
jtd wrote:
On Sunday 07 December 2008 11:03, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions and reduced the requirement of having to stay in Mumbai and do a proper reconnaissance. At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Terrorists are not isolated 4th standard pass idiots as made out to be by our dimwit sec personnel. They have access to far more resources than most police personnel even in well developed countries. And we all know the Pak army dont have digital maps - they just ask around
No amount of guns n gizmos, draconian laws and ban the google will help the woefully corrupt cops. It starts with recruitment and carries on from there. Helped along the way by not being paid salaries for months, political interference, horrendous working conditions etc etc. For all the shouting from the rooftops about Paki support, the Indian government has no evidence from this or any of the past attacks that will withstand scrutiny in a court of law. If it did, it could easily take it's case to the Hague and screw the shit out of pakistan and it's chuppa rustom friend USA without firing a bullet.
The Issue goes a little further,
In a place like Mumbai with nearly 2 Crore population, the terrorists killed about 200,
hardly a nudge in the yearly death rate,
politicians use this as a chance to pass regulations that will harass rest of the population for a lifetime,
Instead of working to build intelligence and rooting out the problem,our country seems to think that harassing our own people is the answer to an external danger
This is akin to what happens to a rape victim
Sad, is'nt it
this is a cause worth fighting for, freedom is a precious thing.
Surya
On Monday 08 December 2008 15:29, Surya Pratap wrote:
No amount of guns n gizmos, draconian laws and ban the google will help the woefully corrupt cops. It starts with recruitment and carries on from there. Helped along the way by not being paid salaries for months, political interference, horrendous working conditions etc etc. For all the shouting from the rooftops about Paki support, the Indian government has no evidence from this or any of the past attacks that will withstand scrutiny in a court of law. If it did, it could easily take it's case to the Hague and screw the shit out of pakistan and it's chuppa rustom friend USA without firing a bullet.
The Issue goes a little further,
Instead of working to build intelligence and rooting out the problem,our country seems to think that harassing our own people is the answer to an external danger
True. It's a wonder that the bent to breaking point populace does not kick up a few thousands terrorists every year. 60 + years after independence one has to just watch shivaji park on 6th Dec, to see the unbelievably pathetic conditions of our rural citizens.
this is a cause worth fighting for, freedom is a precious thing.
Indeed. Lets make sure that the politicos and police dot pass laws that take away our freedom in the name of fighting terrorism.
One often hears the need for a national ID. How exactly is this solving anything? The "hightech" biometric passports introduced in britian are easily spoofed. Besides it requires ALL states on earth to implement and sync their systems to be able to identify probable suspects. There are several dozen rogue states and several more which are ungoverned. a breach in any of these places is all it takes to compromise the system. All that such id solutions will achieve is making dissenters of the status quo easy targets of the state.
Terrence,
On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 4:09 PM, jtd jtd@mtnl.net.in wrote:
One often hears the need for a national ID. How exactly is this solving anything? The "hightech" biometric passports introduced in britian are easily spoofed. Besides it requires ALL states on earth to implement and sync their systems to be able to identify probable suspects. There are several dozen rogue states and several more which are ungoverned. a breach in any of these places is all it takes to compromise the system. All that such id solutions will achieve is making dissenters of the status quo easy targets of the state.
I do not agree. We DO need uniform ID for our citizens. As long as you as citizen have control over who can get what info about you, this is extremely important. The KEY OPERATIVE here is you have CONTROL over WHO has ACCESS to the info about you.
Now there is no so much info that is collected either overtly and/or covertly about you which you neither have any idea nor you have any control over.
And AFA technology is concerned, it's always going to neutral.
-- Rgds JTD
With regards,
Surya Pratap wrote:
jtd wrote:
On Sunday 07 December 2008 11:03, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
The reports say of how the terrorists used these same digital maps to plan their actions and reduced the requirement of having to stay in Mumbai and do a proper reconnaissance. At this time, you will not find many people favouring update of digital maps.
Terrorists are not isolated 4th standard pass idiots as made out to be by our dimwit sec personnel. They have access to far more resources than most police personnel even in well developed countries. And we all know the Pak army dont have digital maps - they just ask around
No amount of guns n gizmos, draconian laws and ban the google will help the woefully corrupt cops. It starts with recruitment and carries on from there. Helped along the way by not being paid salaries for months, political interference, horrendous working conditions etc etc. For all the shouting from the rooftops about Paki support, the Indian government has no evidence from this or any of the past attacks that will withstand scrutiny in a court of law. If it did, it could easily take it's case to the Hague and screw the shit out of pakistan and it's chuppa rustom friend USA without firing a bullet.
The Issue goes a little further,
In a place like Mumbai with nearly 2 Crore population, the terrorists killed about 200,
hardly a nudge in the yearly death rate,
WOW ! The attitude is interesting. I am sure for the people who lost family and friends in the attack will appreciate that its hardly a nudge in the death rate. Good thing people like you are not in control of the country. Or Wait ! They are actually.
politicians use this as a chance to pass regulations that will harass rest of the population for a lifetime,
Instead of working to build intelligence and rooting out the problem,our country seems to think that harassing our own people is the answer to an external danger
This is akin to what happens to a rape victim
Sad, is'nt it
this is a cause worth fighting for, freedom is a precious thing.
Surya
On Monday 08 December 2008 17:37, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
The Issue goes a little further,
In a place like Mumbai with nearly 2 Crore population, the terrorists killed about 200,
hardly a nudge in the yearly death rate,
WOW ! The attitude is interesting. I am sure for the people who lost family and friends in the attack will appreciate that its hardly a nudge in the death rate.
Err. I think he meant that it is not going to make a diff to the politicos (as though anything does). As indeed subsequent events have proved. The "event" was just a nice excuse for getting rid of a few inconvienient politicians. BTW RR Patil was trying to break the police-underworld money nexus. Most dance bars are benami held by cops. On a more cynical note, there are more people dying travelling on the local trains and farmers comiting suicide. But heck it does not stop our cocktails and diner.
jtd wrote:
On Monday 08 December 2008 17:37, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
The Issue goes a little further,
In a place like Mumbai with nearly 2 Crore population, the terrorists killed about 200,
hardly a nudge in the yearly death rate,
WOW ! The attitude is interesting. I am sure for the people who lost family and friends in the attack will appreciate that its hardly a nudge in the death rate.
Err. I think he meant that it is not going to make a diff to the politicos (as though anything does). As indeed subsequent events have proved. The "event" was just a nice excuse for getting rid of a few inconvienient politicians. BTW RR Patil was trying to break the police-underworld money nexus. Most dance bars are benami held by cops. On a more cynical note, there are more people dying travelling on the local trains and farmers comiting suicide. But heck it does not stop our cocktails and diner.
Thanks JTD,
Saswata, Sorry for the bad choice of words, it was just meant to be an objective view of the issue
Surya
Surya Pratap wrote:
jtd wrote:
On Monday 08 December 2008 17:37, Saswata Banerjee wrote:
The Issue goes a little further,
In a place like Mumbai with nearly 2 Crore population, the terrorists killed about 200,
hardly a nudge in the yearly death rate,
WOW ! The attitude is interesting. I am sure for the people who lost family and friends in the attack will appreciate that its hardly a nudge in the death rate.
Err. I think he meant that it is not going to make a diff to the politicos (as though anything does). As indeed subsequent events have proved. The "event" was just a nice excuse for getting rid of a few inconvienient politicians. BTW RR Patil was trying to break the police-underworld money nexus. Most dance bars are benami held by cops. On a more cynical note, there are more people dying travelling on the local trains and farmers comiting suicide. But heck it does not stop our cocktails and diner.
Thanks JTD,
Saswata, Sorry for the bad choice of words, it was just meant to be an objective view of the issue
It is interesting to see the huge flood of messages in this list after the comment on the police action. There is no doubt that people are dying in larger numbers due to non-terror related circumstances but these can be prevented if the individual is more educated about the dangers lurking, like hanging outside a train, finding practical means to pay back a farm loan, avoiding un-clean environments to fight diseases. However a terrorist strike is a strike against an individual's freedom to exist and exist peacefully. This is no different from a mob attack of local political groups. If certain technologies are used to aid such terror attacks then it is quite natural for the security agencies to be cautious about the same. The satt. phones and GPS devices do widen the scope of a terror strike from the lower end of a terror hierarchy, one that can navigate its way with lesser guidance. This increases the headache for the security forces who are already under pressure. By co-operating with them, we are only lessening their burden. Many incompetent Govts. in democracies have realized that the war on terrorism is a viable alternative to good governance. The same is true for Nations under dictators. The only difference is that in a democracy we can change our leaders. We must guard against patriotic criminals who want to use the war on terror to come to power and then dictate our existence according to their whims and fancies. We can do that by not falling into their trap.
On Tuesday 09 December 2008 00:26, Rony wrote:
It is interesting to see the huge flood of messages in this list after the comment on the police action. There is no doubt that people are dying in larger numbers due to non-terror related circumstances but these can be prevented if the individual is more educated about the dangers lurking, like hanging outside a train, finding practical means to pay back a farm loan, avoiding un-clean environments to fight diseases.
Hmmm. I think you have never been to a drought and starvation hit district.... But then that is another story altogether.
However a terrorist strike is a strike against an individual's freedom to exist and exist peacefully. This is no different from a mob attack of local political groups. If certain technologies are used to aid such terror attacks then it is quite natural for the security agencies to be cautious about the same. The satt. phones and GPS devices do widen the scope of a terror strike from the lower end of a terror hierarchy, one that can navigate its way with lesser guidance. This increases the headache for the security forces who are already under pressure.
Wrong. It allows the vast majority of law abiding citizens to improve their lot. Mobile phones are also used by terrorist. GPS usage was restricted precisely because maps were not available. Do you know that you can compute local atmospheric conditions and thus derive accurate weather data using the gps sat broadcasts.
By co-operating with them, we are only lessening their burden. Many incompetent Govts. in democracies have realized that the war on terrorism is a viable alternative to good governance. The same is true for Nations under dictators.
It is precisely these and many other so called good governments who went about arming rogue nations and warlords to suit their short term goals. These arms have been dished out to terrorists ($50 for an AK47 in Kandhar). Manufacturing RDX requires a massive plant. And sale of these is tightly controlled right? And these are not of much use to ordinary folks? And ordinary folks cant even use these if they are given one? So where is the catch?
Terror strikes are of two types the political (Naxals, Peoples war group LTTE etc) and the destabilisers (LET, Alquaida). Both depend on disenfranchised groups of people as delivery mechanisms. So preventing terror attacks requires far more resources than gizmos and two hundred commandos. Infact right now the state of India is pathetically ill equipped to stop terror. All the ban this and that proposals are not to prevent terror, but merely to prevent a political fallout and the public kicking the politicos ass.
The only difference is that in a democracy we can change our leaders. We must guard against patriotic criminals who want to use the war on terror to come to power and then dictate our existence according to their whims and fancies. We can do that by not falling into their trap.
Couldnt agree more.
jtd wrote:
On Tuesday 09 December 2008 00:26, Rony wrote:
It is interesting to see the huge flood of messages in this list after the comment on the police action. There is no doubt that people are dying in larger numbers due to non-terror related circumstances but these can be prevented if the individual is more educated about the dangers lurking, like hanging outside a train, finding practical means to pay back a farm loan, avoiding un-clean environments to fight diseases.
Hmmm. I think you have never been to a drought and starvation hit district.... But then that is another story altogether.
Neglect of backward areas is different from a terror strike.
On Thursday 11 December 2008 20:45, Rony wrote:
jtd wrote:
On Tuesday 09 December 2008 00:26, Rony wrote:
It is interesting to see the huge flood of messages in this list after the comment on the police action. There is no doubt that people are dying in larger numbers due to non-terror related circumstances but these can be prevented if the individual is more educated about the dangers lurking, like hanging outside a train, finding practical means to pay back a farm loan, avoiding un-clean environments to fight diseases.
Hmmm. I think you have never been to a drought and starvation hit district.... But then that is another story altogether.
Neglect of backward areas is different from a terror strike.
Thats where the delivery boys come from. In the short term screwing the sponsoring organisation is ok. But if u dont get rid of the economic compulsion of marginalised people to participate in terror groups, new terror groups will replace the ones dismantled. We cant to do much about our neighbours economies but we can focus on the foibles of our policy makers
In short terrorism cant be neutralised with guns, training , banning etc. You require all of these actions together.
For the new comers: Terrorism was rampant in the late 60s and early seventies in the form of Naxalites. Some called them revolutionaries others terrorists.
jtd wrote:
On Thursday 11 December 2008 20:45, Rony wrote:
jtd wrote:
On Tuesday 09 December 2008 00:26, Rony wrote:
It is interesting to see the huge flood of messages in this list after the comment on the police action. There is no doubt that people are dying in larger numbers due to non-terror related circumstances but these can be prevented if the individual is more educated about the dangers lurking, like hanging outside a train, finding practical means to pay back a farm loan, avoiding un-clean environments to fight diseases.
Hmmm. I think you have never been to a drought and starvation hit district.... But then that is another story altogether.
Neglect of backward areas is different from a terror strike.
Thats where the delivery boys come from. In the short term screwing the sponsoring organisation is ok. But if u dont get rid of the economic compulsion of marginalised people to participate in terror groups, new terror groups will replace the ones dismantled. We cant to do much about our neighbours economies but we can focus on the foibles of our policy makers
Just like the underworld, terrorism is an underground movement that has moved on from its original revolutionary ideology. There will always be a group of people who want to live life on the edge, where power and wealth beckons them. Its pure business. Just as we have patriotic criminals who want to use the legitimate route to gain absolute power, there are others who will take to crime to achieve the same.
Saswata and Satya,
On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 5:37 PM, Saswata Banerjee scrapo@saswatabanerjee.com wrote:
Surya Pratap wrote:
The Issue goes a little further,
In a place like Mumbai with nearly 2 Crore population, the terrorists killed about 200,
hardly a nudge in the yearly death rate,
WOW ! The attitude is interesting. I am sure for the people who lost family and friends in the attack will appreciate that its hardly a nudge in the death rate. Good thing people like you are not in control of the country. Or Wait ! They are actually.
@Saswata - I agree with you completely. We Indian do not take other people's lives seriously. At times, we are so insensitive to such issues, which reflects in our every walk of our life, including politics and other areas. May be this is the problem of plenty? Or is it our belief in reincarnation or our belief in life after death?
politicians use this as a chance to pass regulations that will harass rest of the population for a lifetime,
@Satya - This is what we should fight against. You CAN NOT be more secure by giving more control and power to others including the State.
Instead of working to build intelligence and rooting out the problem,our country seems to think that harassing our own people is the answer to an external danger
This is akin to what happens to a rape victim
True... We somehow collectively always reach wrong conclusions and policies. I have seen many so called educated, inteligent and savvy people demanding dictatorship, army rule and emergency! Can you believe that?
Sad, is'nt it
this is a cause worth fighting for, freedom is a precious thing.
Surya
With regards,
True... We somehow collectively always reach wrong conclusions and policies. I have seen many so called educated, inteligent and savvy people demanding dictatorship, army rule and emergency! Can you believe that?
I am educated, intelligent and savvy and demand dictatorship, army rule, and emergency! :-( It's lot better than ruled by bunch of jokers....
But then how it's related to Linux , except FREEDOM ;-)
Warm Regards,
Mukund Deshmukh, Beta Computronics Pvt Ltd. 10/1 IT Park, Parsodi, Nagpur -440022 India. Web site - http://betacomp.com
Meet us at our Stall No M91 Hall No 18 MZ , PLASTINDIA 2009 , Feb 4 -9, 2009, Pragati Maidan, New Delhi, INDIA
On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 6:34 PM, Mukund Deshmukh mukund.deshmukh@gmail.comwrote:
True... We somehow collectively always reach wrong conclusions and policies. I have seen many so called educated, inteligent and savvy people demanding dictatorship, army rule and emergency! Can you believe that?
I am educated, intelligent and savvy and demand dictatorship, army rule, and emergency! :-( It's lot better than ruled by bunch of jokers....
But then how it's related to Linux , except FREEDOM ;-)
Wrong. It may or may not be better than ruled by a bunch of jokers. Seems like you want to be ruled by a king who is kind, compassionate, generous to name a few qualities. Okay now, maybe this king that comes to power has all the qualities needed by a king. But what if he gets greedy after a while? What if his success as a king starts going to his head and he starts to screw things up? What if he starts giving orders to shoot people just for the fun of it -- ahem, extermination of Jews -- if you understand the analogy? Precisely to avoid situations like these, democracy was invented!
And lastly, what if the king bans Linux? ;-)
power has all the qualities needed by a king. But what if he gets greedy after a while? What if his success as a king starts going to his head and he starts to screw things up? What if he starts giving orders to shoot people just for the fun of it -- ahem, extermination of Jews -- if you understand the analogy?
We already have hundreds of such king around us.... look beyond maharashtra.
Precisely to avoid situations like these, democracy was invented!
Democracy is very expensive, and we have already paid a heavy price..... look beyond India ( China).
And lastly, what if the king bans Linux? ;-)
It's already banned at many places by M$ King.
Warm Regards,
Mukund Deshmukh, Beta Computronics Pvt Ltd. 10/1 IT Park, Parsodi, Nagpur -440022 India. Web site - http://betacomp.com
Meet us at our Stall No M91 Hall No 18 MZ , PLASTINDIA 2009 , Feb 4 -9, 2009, Pragati Maidan, New Delhi, INDIA
On Tuesday 09 December 2008 09:53, Mukund Deshmukh wrote:
power has all the qualities needed by a king. But what if he gets greedy after a while? What if his success as a king starts going to his head and he starts to screw things up? What if he starts giving orders to shoot people just for the fun of it -- ahem, extermination of Jews -- if you understand the analogy?
We already have hundreds of such king around us.... look beyond maharashtra.
Precisely to avoid situations like these, democracy was invented!
Democracy is very expensive, and we have already paid a heavy price..... look beyond India ( China).
China. Great dictators. Until they demolish your block, or drown your home under some dam. And shoot you if you protest. Oh well same as Inde, but here you get to throw em out every few years. Neat this election thing.
And lastly, what if the king bans Linux? ;-)
It's already banned at many places by M$ King.
Warm Regards,
Mukund Deshmukh, Beta Computronics Pvt Ltd. 10/1 IT Park, Parsodi, Nagpur -440022 India. Web site - http://betacomp.com
Meet us at our Stall No M91 Hall No 18 MZ , PLASTINDIA 2009 , Feb 4 -9, 2009, Pragati Maidan, New Delhi, INDIA
jtd wrote:
China. Great dictators. Until they demolish your block, or drown your home under some dam. And shoot you if you protest. Oh well same as Inde, but here you get to throw em out every few years. Neat this election thing.
True! Today's TOI has a report on how Chinese officials put complaining citizens in mental asylums and keep them under sedation till they take back their case. There is no such thing as a good dictator.
Like FOSS, democracy is a community effort. No short cuts to it. :-)
On Tuesday 09 Dec 2008 11:44:34 am Rony wrote:
China. Great dictators. Until they demolish your block, or drown your home under some dam. And shoot you if you protest. Oh well same as Inde, but here you get to throw em out every few years. Neat this election thing.
True! Today's TOI has a report on how Chinese officials put complaining citizens in mental asylums and keep them under sedation till they take back their case. There is no such thing as a good dictator.
Like FOSS, democracy is a community effort. No short cuts to it. :-)
and if all the time and energy spent on this debate had been spent on rectifying the OSM map of Mumbai, the citizens of Mumbai would have benefited greatly. (btw, mapping is illegal in China)
-
Amit Joshi -
Dinesh Shah (દિન ેશ શાહ/द िनेश शाह) -
H.S.Rai -
jtd -
Kenneth Gonsalves -
Mukund Deshmukh -
Rony -
Rony Bill
-
Saswata Banerjee -
shirish -
Surya Pratap