I seem to have tread on many a toe here. But that never got me down... so let me continue so that the cluless newbies you so mention at the end of this mail get another opinion at least - and then they have a *choice* to choose from... :)
At 10:24 morn 9/6/02 +0530, TH wrote:
That's not a merit of Windows or a demerit of Linux. That's the result of Microsoft's monopolistic stranglehold on the market. You can run "any dam" souncard in Windows because the vendor of that card ships drivers for Windows with it. How many cards can you plug into WinXP and run them without vendor provided software? BTW, some of the reputed hardware vendors are now shipping Linux drivers with their products, nVIDIA, for instance.
Because Linux user base is growing. Because it makes business sense. Not because they have had a soft corner for the open people. If tomorrow Windows user base shrinks to <1% I am sure these same vendors will stop supporting it. Sure, Microsoft had a monopoly on the market, which is changing now (thanks to open source), but *that* was the result of how our society does business. Microsoft is not to blame. Did you know what it costs for treatment of Hepatitis B treatment with top of the line US made drugs? A couple of lakhs. So if my maid gets H-B tomorrow, she dies. She dies even when the manufacturing cost of the drugs may be only a few thousand rupees at the most. That is how the current world works. Sure is not great. But...
I agree that that X Windows is not the God of all GUI systems. Nor is MS Windows' GUI. Not the Mac either. Everyone of them has shortcomings. What hurts the most is that people use such generalized and derogatory words as "suxx" to degrade the efforts of brilliant programmers who are trying to make things better so that getting stuck into a monopoly is not as "easy" or "natural" as it is today. The word "suxx" has a really strong implication. I don't recall anyone saying "Windows suxx" in this thread.
Ummmmm... I thought suxx was an infinitely more friendly term then the cold "windows is good for nothing" quote by some senior member. I seem to be on the Windows side, but if you (had) looked closer all I was doing was arguing points against windows which were contrived (IMHO). I have been using Linux for long and appreciate the "brilliant programmers" who are doing a wonderful job by giving us their time. There was a time when for long stretches I had only Linux running on my machine. I hated windows 95. But I loved M$Dos. I learned my programming on Dos and had the most fun till date experimenting/hacking. I hated win 3.11 but I came to like windows 98SE because in my experience it did what is does in a good way. Is that a crime or is stating this in a Linux Group a Crime. Anyway I mentioned in only as an aside. The argument started on some different point altogether.
This brings us to the issue of criticizing Linux on this forum. Indeed criticizing is positive but to what extent is some critique helpful?
All this thread and previous thread are about morality/ethics/philosophy and are not technical for anyone to claim their correctness or falsehood. These are also important as, much of what Linux is about, is the philosophy.
Do we have anyone on this list who's directly involved with the development of X or any of the Window Managers or Desktop Environments?
Does that mean only those who develop are supposed to talk about it? There are developer mailing lists for that.
The best form of criticism is submitting bug reports to the developers. That, dear users of Linux, is what makes you hope for improvements in what you get.
I agree. But that is an action you should do, if you can. It has nothing to do with a discussion here. But do you know that to send any worthwhile bug report manually you need some technical competence? Sending "hey my X hangs on startup" does not help. Most of the people who actually test and report bugs closely follow the development.
This list also has people who are newbies and are here to get a clue. What message do we send out to them when we make grossly subjective statements about some rough edges of a part of Linux? And what message do we send to them when we whine like losers against the monopoly that Microsoft is?
More than that, the whining against "closed" software which is made out to be evil.
Linux may not be the best OS. Rather it *is not* the best OS. But it is good enough for anyone who wants to break free from the monopoly - and I mean _anyone_ when I say anyone.
Amen ! (again, Amen !!)
quasi p.s. if I have tread on some sensitive toes, I say sorry and am willing to compensate with some balm. ;-D