Linuxers February 2003

linuxers@mm.ilug-bom.org.in

132 participants
209 discussions

RMS in Mumbai !
by Dileep M. Kumar 18 Feb '03

18 Feb '03

Date: 14th February 2003 >>Richard M. Stallman will be in Mumbai on the 14th of February 2003 to >>speak on GNU and Free Software at the Quadrangle of VJTI, Mumbai. Have this speech recorded. Is it available for download. Regards -- .''`. Dileep M. Kumar <dileep(a)kumarayil.net> : :' : http://www.kumarayil.net `. `'` `- Debian GNU/Linux - Choice of the Freedom Lovers

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Re: DEBATE what cud have goa done....
by Gurpreet Singh 18 Feb '03

18 Feb '03

hi all what are friend "cromium" (nice name ;)... ) says is... LET THE STUDENTS START WITH M$ AND ONCE THEY KNOW HOW TO USE THE COMP U SHIFT THEM TO GNU/LINUX(right??) i certainly disagree dear, coz in that case what the students get to learn in windoze and not the compy. i am off the veiw that the world today is having these probs in switching over bcoz **they have grown with windoze** now what we need is that a child when he starts learning how to use the computer, sud start off with gnu/linux right away... he will anyways have that problem in learning windoze so why not have that trouble for something better... infact that is why i want to stress on the point that we shud aim at the spread to gnu/linux in the **schools** and i raised this point at GNUnify in pune too... we have been organizing workshops in engg colleges n all, WHY NOT TARGET A FEW SCHOOLS NOW?? this goes out as a spl request to ppl like trevor, dinesh bhai, dr nag. lets get to a few schools, at least as an experiment.. wat say? regards Gurpreet Gurpreet Singh Student Final Yr Computer Sc. & Engg. --------------------------------------------------------------------- M A K E Y O U R O W N R O A D --------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: Perl Beginning Books
by Meeta Kherdekar 18 Feb '03

18 Feb '03

Hi, you will find a good collection of technical books at, 1) http://freebooks.by.ru/ bye meeta

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Perl Beginning books
by akshaysalkar 18 Feb '03

18 Feb '03

I have a good perl book for seccond hand. Programming Perl - Larry Wall you can purchase from me at approx Rs.400 regards. email me at akshaysalkar(a)indiatimes.com -- linuxers(a)mm.ilug-bom.org.in wrote: nyone having ideas regarding free ebooks for it . or ny good book to begin with -- _______________________________________________ http://mm.ilug-bom.org.in/mailman/listinfo/linuxers Get Your Private, Free E-mail from Indiatimes at http://email.indiatimes.com Buy the best in Movies at http://www.videos.indiatimes.com Bid for for Air Tickets @ Re.1 on Air Sahara Flights. Just log on to http://airsahara.indiatimes.com and Bid Now!

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[OT] fwd: {SPAM?} ADV: Enjoy a spam-free inbox
by Sameer D. Sahasrabuddhe 18 Feb '03

18 Feb '03

Hi all, Here's a message that I got recently. As you can see its from some dot-com who thinks its good at handling spam. The mail itself got marked as "SPAM" on the IITB servers, by the way! ;-) ----- Forwarded message from Spam Arrest <info(a)spamarrest.com> ----- Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 05:19:09 -0800 From: Spam Arrest <info(a)spamarrest.com> X-Scanned: By Symantec Carrier Scan Server Subject: {SPAM?} ADV: Enjoy a spam-free inbox To: "Sameer D. Sahasrabuddhe" <sameerds(a)it.iitb.ac.in> You may remember recently sending an email to a Spam Arrest customer, and receiving a response asking you to visit our website and type in a word that was shown to you in a picture. <snip> ----- End forwarded message ----- I do remember getting such a mail from a person named Rishi on this group. And I had replied to him saying that please try to keep mailing lists out of this hassle. Now through him spamarrest decides it has found an email address worth sending adverisements to, which I consider spam. Does that mean Rishi is responsible for my account getting these mails? Is there any place where I can discuss this with people involved in tackling the spam problem? Sameer.

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GNUnify diary for 16th ....
by Ravindra Jaju 17 Feb '03

17 Feb '03

I was lucky enough to visit GNUnify. A short write-up for the 2nd day at: http://www.it.iitb.ac.in/~jaju/articles/?id=160203gnunify -- jaju

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Confussion in DRBD and ENBD
by Srinivas 17 Feb '03

17 Feb '03

Hi all I am having some little bit of confussion in DRBD and ENBD(Enhanced Network Block devise). Drbd is a file system for mirroring systems across a LAN. Enbd does same thing but it is not a file system. I am not understanding the exact difference between these two. What is the full name of DRBD. any one plz help me. thanx in advance. Regards Srinivasa Rao NatureSoft Pvt. Ltd. 11-20, 2nd Lane, Appu street, Mylapore, Chennai-600004. Phones:24617193/94/95. Extn:34

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] Re:DEBATE: What could Goa have done with ten million rupees..
by jtdsouza＠softhome.net 17 Feb '03

17 Feb '03

On Monday 17 February 2003 10:47, Cromium C wrote: > * Lacture by Richard Stallman @ VJTI on 14th Feb. 2003 @ 6:00pm. * > Hi everybody, > > I am an avid Linux fan. But we have gotta face it: > what the CM of Goa said was right: in their present > avataars, all distros of Linux, including Redhat 8.0, > are difficult for kids. What is the basis of this statement? have you done any study? > We have to keep in mind that > in a classroom, there are roughly three varieties of > kids: sharp, average, and dumb. We have to try and > cater atleast to the first two. And Linux distros are > NOT good for average beginners (though the sharp > beginners might take to them like fish take to water.) > The solution is to let the kids have the M$ > handholding at first. Let em have it easy. After they > have picked up the basics, they can move over to > Linux. Absolute rubbish. Unlearning bad habits is a far more difficult, time consuming and costly process. Even worse is that you are spending money to inculcate bad habits (the worst being paying money to buy rubbish). > Especially when they are ready for some > programming action. Its very bad to start learning > your programming on an M$ platform. (just as its very > bad for an average guy to start learning to use a > computer on a Linux platform.) You are confusing familarity with learning ability. For a peson who has never used Win98/95, using GNU/Linux is as easy as learning something new. After he is familiar with Linux he finds it only little more complicated (but a lot more frustrating) using win98. I say this from first hand experience with my 6 year old nephew and his friends. This group were a motley group of neighbourhood kids ranging from 3 yrs to 10 yrs, some going to convent schools and some to vernacular. They used the PC mostly for games. They would happily boot into windows or RH6.2 (this was in 2000) and play whatever games they had decided to play. What did they prefer? The 3 to 5 yr olds most suprisingly preferred linux and it's simple games like smashing billgates. The others preferences depended on which game they liked. some fell for quake, some for flight simulator or car racing and hence linux. my nephew played NBA which was available only on win98 and used that mostly, but kept nagging me to get the linux version because windows would crash. Bottom line - arbitary statements made without basis are not useful. And I much prefer truthful hotheads than the pleasant misinformed. > > There are gonna be some hotheads here who will flame > me. But before doing that, just apply your > commonsense- No not commonsense but observation. You will surprise yourself with the results. > your level of intellect ain't shared by > all em kids at Goa. The CM of Goa being an IIT guy, > could see that. You dont need Einstein's abilities to start an application on a pc my friend - a 6 yr old is clever enough to use one. Suprising that an IIT alumini fails to understand the learning process (which IMHO is what the IITs are all about). rgds jtdsouza(a)softhome.net

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Re: [ILUG-BOM] DEBATE: What could Goa have done with ten million rupees..
by jtdsouza＠softhome.net 17 Feb '03

17 Feb '03

On Monday 17 February 2003 00:42, FN wrote: > ... if this money was not paid to Microsoft for software licences > for some 3000 Std XI science students, on the excuse that GNU/Linux > is too-difficult for them to cope with.... Maybe this decision was influenced by the faculty, who would have to do some "hard" learning. Decisions like these are part of a more complex problem in (our) society - the "qickfix" mentality. It has seeped into all aspects of society. The vast majority of students today study not with the intent of aquiring knowledge but solely with the aim of aquiring a degree - a passport to a job. Most do not have the foggiest idea of what goes on behind the screen, let alone the unholy machinations of governments and bussinesses. Visit a bank, or a railway booking centre. Are the people at the counter doing anything intelligent?. Or a hotel, a restaurant - are the waiters and receptionists doing anything intelligent. The vast maority will be destined for jobs like these. They will be only consumers not creators of resources, most will become obstructions in the path to more effecient societies. And why do we want to rely on the government for anything? Why did the colleges not take the initiative to become autonomous and independent?. IMHO cause that brings responsibility and uncertainty. Governments and bussinesses are busy exploiting the inability of society to accept responsibility. So what has this got to do with GNU/Linux. The target audience. So far the target has been users. We should now focus on the decision makers in educational institutions. How about a workshop for lectures and professors in Maharashtra. Self help with a little help from your friends that's what GNU/Linux is about. (I promise i will deliver a lecture on embedded systems at this workshop ;-)). Society expects somone else to foot the bill so we have "subsidised" education, travel, petrol, housing, software - GNU software being the exception - the subsidy being far more expensive than the unsubsidised product elsewhere. In the case of Libre software not only is it cheap, it has a multiplicator effect as pieces of code are reused to create evermore useful stuff, thus making it even cheaper. > > o Set up a Free Software Research Lab that would have build assets > of a permanent nature -- of the human kind > o Invest in additional 500 computers, at approx Rs 20,000 per Why do they not make the students assemble the machines. That would nearly halve the price. And the senior students maintain them. That will cutoff recuring costs. And the software students write apps to solve the counter clerk problem and ...... > PS: Of course, don't expect politicians and decision-makers to be > convinced by arguments such as these... Oh but you dont need the politicians any way. That is half the problem solved. What can Goa do without ten million rupeees. A lot. Starting with empowering the faculty with GNU/Linux. ^^^^^^ rgds jtdsouza(a)softhome.net

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Re:DEBATE: What could Goa have done with ten million rupees...
by Cromium C 17 Feb '03

17 Feb '03

Hi everybody, I am an avid Linux fan. But we have gotta face it: what the CM of Goa said was right: in their present avataars, all distros of Linux, including Redhat 8.0, are difficult for kids. We have to keep in mind that in a classroom, there are roughly three varieties of kids: sharp, average, and dumb. We have to try and cater atleast to the first two. And Linux distros are NOT good for average beginners (though the sharp beginners might take to them like fish take to water.) The solution is to let the kids have the M$ handholding at first. Let em have it easy. After they have picked up the basics, they can move over to Linux. Especially when they are ready for some programming action. Its very bad to start learning your programming on an M$ platform. (just as its very bad for an average guy to start learning to use a computer on a Linux platform.) There are gonna be some hotheads here who will flame me. But before doing that, just apply your commonsense- your level of intellect ain't shared by all em kids at Goa. The CM of Goa being an IIT guy, could see that. Hola, Cromium. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Everything you'll ever need on one web page from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my.yahoo.com

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Linuxers February 2003